Rule 7.08e reinstated force play

[rbmartin]

I was wanting some clarification regarding the part of rule 7.08e which states "However, if the forced runner, after touching the next base, retreats for any reason towards the base he had last occupied, the force play is reinstated, and he can again be put out if the defense tags the base to which he is forced;"

Here is the situation: Runner on first, one out. Batter bunts and beats out the throw to first. R1 rounds 2b. As F3 throws to F6, R1 slides back into 2b but overslides it (unintentionally)(to the 1st base side of 2b). F6 steps on 2b before R1 retouches 2b, but does not tag the runner.
Is the runner out via rule 7.08e?

Thanks

[mbyron]

Yes, though some will want to apply J/R's "relaxed/unrelaxed" distinction here to say that the runner must be tagged.

Here's another play. R1, less than 2 outs. R1 goes with the pitch. Batter flies to deep left. R1 rounds 2B, sees F7 will get to the fly ball in time, and turns around to avoid getting doubled off. He touches 2B as he goes back to 1B, reinstating the force. F7 drops the ball as R1 approaches 1B. As R1 turns around again to head to 2B, F7 throws to F4 covering 2B, who catches it for the force out.

[rbmartin]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Yes, though some will want to apply J/R's "relaxed/unrelaxed" distinction here to say that the runner must be tagged.

Here's another play. R1, less than 2 outs. R1 goes with the pitch. Batter flies to deep left. R1 rounds 2B, sees F7 will get to the fly ball in time, and turns around to avoid getting doubled off. He touches 2B as he goes back to 1B, reinstating the force. F7 drops the ball as R1 approaches 1B. As R1 turns around again to head to 2B, F7 throws to F4 covering 2B, who catches it for the force out.

I agree that the runner in your situation would be out since he obviously "retreated", however, I am not not sure oversliding a base (my situation) constitutes a "retreat".

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by rbmartin

I agree that the runner in your situation would be out since he obviously "retreated", however, I am not not sure oversliding a base (my situation) constitutes a "retreat".

Why wouldn't it?

Consider this: suppose the ball gets away from the fielder on your play, allowing R1 to advance to 3B. If he fails to touch 2B on his way past and the defense appeals correctly, how will you rule on the missed base appeal?

I would call the runner out for the missed base. So I would have no choice but to treat your original play as a "retreat" that reinstates the force.

[TwoBits]

I'm trying to visualize how a runner retreating back to second could possibly overslide towards the first base side. I suppose its possible, but sounds more like a third world play that would never happen.

[SAump]

A tag must be applied.

Here is the situation: Runner on first, one out. Batter bunts and beats out the throw to first. R1 rounds 2b. As F3 throws to F6, R1 slides back into 2b but overslides it (unintentionally)(to the 1st base side of 2b). F6 steps on 2b before R1 retouches 2b, but does not tag the runner.
Is the runner out via rule 7.08e?

B/R occupies 1B. R1 may not return to 1B. If R1 returns immediately to 2B, then a tag must be applied. If R1 makes no attempt to return to 2B, enforce 7.08e.

Ruling: Safe.

[GA Umpire]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Why wouldn't it?

Consider this: suppose the ball gets away from the fielder on your play, allowing R1 to advance to 3B. If he fails to touch 2B on his way past and the defense appeals correctly, how will you rule on the missed base appeal?

I would call the runner out for the missed base. So I would have no choice but to treat your original play as a "retreat" that reinstates the force.

So, what if the runner slides to the LF side of the base? He is still technically beyond 2B isn't he. Thus, the force cannot be reinstated. And, I would not uphold an appeal of the base unless the runner shows an effort to go to another base.

Instead of watching which side he slides on, just watch the runner's actions and let them guide the umpire as to what the runner is trying to do.

If he is trying to retreat to a previous base, then I would uphold the appeal if the runner misses the base when attempting to advance. If he slides or overruns the base and then immediately turns to run to the advance base, I would not uphold an appeal since he showed no effort to retreat to a previous base other than the one he touched(or tried to).