Little League: Kentucky vs. Texas

[DG]

Originally Posted by jwwashburn

So, after a walk, if the catcher fires the ball back to the pitcher, the BR has to go to first and stay? Is there something in there about there having to be a batter in the box or, just the pitcher and catcher must be ready?

I can imagine some interesting walks with a runner on third situations...

In regular season play maybe, but in WS play the defense should know what to do..

[SethPDX]

Originally Posted by zm1283

The PU got all four infield umpires together to discuss it.

If that's me and I don't have CI, there is no way I'm asking a BU for help. Of all that calls that you should get on your own, that is one of the most obvious.

This is very common in LL, at every level, and every tournament (not in the games I work, where I get my own call as often as possible and ask for help quickly if needed).

Let's get the call right. Let's make sure we're all on the same page. Don't get me wrong--I'm all in favor of that, but it gets taken way overboard IMO.

Last year, at the LL Softball World Series here in Portland, I saw a PU and 1BU talk for a good 30 seconds about a swipe tag before the BU changed his call from safe to out. Could have been solved with a simple "Do you have a tag?" yes or no question, but that's LL...

This year, 3BU calls a runner safe on a banger at third. Defensive manager comes out, has a brief, calm word w/3BU, end of story, right? Well, DM must have convinced the 3BU to get all four infield umpires together. What made him decide to get with 3 other umpires who were all farther away from the play than he was I don't know, other than the DM asked and the BU wanted to keep him happy.

The LL umpire's willingness to have a board meeting on every somewhat controversial play is something I wish would change.

[briancurtin]

Originally Posted by SethPDX

This year, 3BU calls a runner safe on a banger at third. Defensive manager comes out, has a brief, calm word w/3BU, end of story, right? Well, DM must have convinced the 3BU to get all four infield umpires together. What made him decide to get with 3 other umpires who were all farther away from the play than he was I don't know, other than the DM asked and the BU wanted to keep him happy.

A coach asking you to get help on that play receives "absolutely not" followed by turning and walking away.

[SethPDX]

Originally Posted by briancurtin

A coach asking you to get help on that play receives "absolutely not" followed by turning and walking away.

I would have said something to that effect as well.

[yawetag]

Originally Posted by jdmara

I beg to differ. They point out consistently that EVERYONE is a volunteer. There have been plenty of times they could have thrown the umpires under the bus and they refrain most every time.

-Josh

It also appears they don't show replays of close calls more than once or twice, and I have yet to see a replay of a called strike three.

[kheisner]

Some of those poor kids have gotten rung up on some real nasty strike three calls this week.

It is not like the MLB World Series where they replay those calls.

[johnnyg08]

Originally Posted by yawetag

It also appears they don't show replays of close calls more than once or twice, and I have yet to see a replay of a called strike three.

I think it's in the MLB rules...they're not supposed to show it at the game anyway. Unless you're referring to the LLWS which the thread it titled...then I guess I don't know.

[MOofficial]

If anyone saw the Japan vs. Mexico game last night, the word "nasty" for at least two of the third strikes does not do it enough justice. The catcher was set up at least half way in the other batters box, pitcher threw it right where he was suppose to, batter watches the ball go right here which is about 2 ft from the plate, and the PU rings em up and sets em down.

Do not get me wrong I do my fair share of games for that age group in the summer in my hometown to help out with the program and the zone does get big when the game is dragging on, but to call that on ESPN, only the biggest sports station in the world, for kids who are the best in the world in that age group is a little disappointing. The only way a batter would be able to even think about touching those pitches would be with an oar, and thats the truth. No "legal" bat would come close to that unless you step on the plate to swing.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by MOofficial

If anyone saw the Japan vs. Mexico game last night, the word "nasty" for at least two of the third strikes does not do it enough justice. The catcher was set up at least half way in the other batters box, pitcher threw it right where he was suppose to, batter watches the ball go right here which is about 2 ft from the plate, and the PU rings em up and sets em down.

Do not get me wrong I do my fair share of games for that age group in the summer in my hometown to help out with the program and the zone does get big when the game is dragging on, but to call that on ESPN, only the biggest sports station in the world, for kids who are the best in the world in that age group is a little disappointing. The only way a batter would be able to even think about touching those pitches would be with an oar, and thats the truth. No "legal" bat would come close to that unless you step on the plate to swing.

Yeah, even Eric Gregg would have thought those pitches were balls. Pretty brutal umpiring in this LLWS overall. Some good, but some dreadful.

But they're all volunteers!

[kheisner]

I guess you can say, You get what you pay for

I know I'm not perfect, but if I were umpiring on national TV....I sure as hell would try harder. I don't know what some of these guys are looking at. Their ball & strike calls have been consistently inconsistent. I'd expect that out of some of the 16-yr old park district umps....but these guys are supposed to be the best!! This year they are terrible...just terrible!

I really feel sorry for the kids. They deserve better.

[aceholleran]

Trust me, the LLWS umps this year are the best I've ever seen (at the WS). Before you get your flamethrowers out, read on.

This shows you how bad it's been in the past. At least we're not getting ball-strike calls before the rock hits the mitt, as I've seen in the past.

The reason why these guys look so bad is that they are virtually all big cheeses in their local areas. They have developed bad habits over the years (witness the constant "play" business), and there's no one to tell them about the mistakes-- they are the assignors, etc. It's like the emperor's new clothes. Most of these guys have never even done a HS JV game. I see them at LL sectional, state and regional levels all the time.

I think LL is a great place to start, but I didn't hone my skills until I did HS, Legion and college/ex-pro summer ball.

These poor guys can't do the "casual out" at first; every foul ball is a major production; dress up that swinging strike 3--it's fine. It's ingrained. Don't forget that these officials aren't even vetted at the regional level. They get these assignments by recommendation. I am going to try to make it to ER in Bristol, CT next year. Chances are slim and none.

I don't blame this august group for hopping on some of these Smitties. Just remember that they don't think there's a thing wrong with their game.

Ace in CT

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by aceholleran

I don't blame this august group for hopping on some of these Smitties. Just remember that they don't think there's a thing wrong with their game.

Then they should read my Liitle League® World Series thread at the other forum.

[RPatrino]

Ace is 100% correct. The umpires we see at the LLWS are at the "top" of their game, they are being rewarded for their dedication to Little League and their local communities. Agree with Little League or not, they reward those in their organization that fit the mold of the Little League Umpire.

Like the old saying goes, " one year experience repeated 20 times", which is the case with SOME LL umpires, but NOT all. Some are dedicated to honing their craft, but like Ace, I agree that moving up to higher caliber ball is the only realy way to hone your skills.

As to what LL wants done in their environment, disagree or not, it's their game, it will be done their way or you won't be doing it at the Regional or WS level. There are times when what we do at the HS level would seem out of place in a Little League sanctioned game, just like what LL wants to see their umpires do would seem foreign to us at the HS level.

[Ump153]

Originally Posted by aceholleran

Trust me, the LLWS umps this year are the best I've ever seen (at the WS).

I have to disagree. Four or five years ago, LLWS has a great group of umpires, many of whom worked D-1 Ball. As I recall, even this board had a good deal of praise for the umps that year.

This year's cast of fools have even screwed up basic rules and thrown each other under the bus. They are an embarrassment.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

Ace is 100% correct. The umpires we see at the LLWS are at the "top" of their game, they are being rewarded for their dedication to Little League and their local communities. Agree with Little League or not, they reward those in their organization that fit the mold of the Little League Umpire.

Like the old saying goes, " one year experience repeated 20 times", which is the case with SOME LL umpires, but NOT all. Some are dedicated to honing their craft, but like Ace, I agree that moving up to higher caliber ball is the only realy way to hone your skills.

As to what LL wants done in their environment, disagree or not, it's their game, it will be done their way or you won't be doing it at the Regional or WS level. There are times when what we do at the HS level would seem out of place in a Little League sanctioned game, just like what LL wants to see their umpires do would seem foreign to us at the HS level.

Disagree.

Originally Posted by Ump153

I have to disagree. Four or five years ago, LLWS has a great group of umpires, many of whom worked D-1 Ball. As I recall, even this board had a good deal of praise for the umps that year.

This year's cast of fools have even screwed up basic rules and thrown each other under the bus. They are an embarrassment.

Agree.