Giving Game Fees back

[Kevin Finnerty]

My experience with running travel tournament teams for many years shows that the parents of most travel ball players need much less of a break than the average umpire.

[yawetag]

Originally Posted by Kevin Finnerty

Or how about when you drive 30 or 40 miles and find out the game was canceled a day and a half ago, but no one even considered picking up a telephone and notifying the umpires?

If this were a high school game in my association, you're screwed. It's our job to call the school and verify the game is still on before leaving for the game. If the game is still on, you get the name of the person and drive to the school. If the game gets canceled at any time after that, you're paid for the game.

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by yawetag

If this were a high school game in my association, you're screwed. It's our job to call the school and verify the game is still on before leaving for the game. If the game is still on, you get the name of the person and drive to the school. If the game gets canceled at any time after that, you're paid for the game.

We have the same procedure in my association here in CT. We have to call the schools to verify especially sub-Varsity and Middle School games. However, if we are told that the game is on and we show up and the game is off or moved, we are still paid (under contract with the schools). The assigner handles all the dirty details in those cases.

[johnnyg08]

I think on game day, the schools should hold the burden of calling/emailing the umpires...it shouldn't fall solely on the umpires...esp on game day...

[tballump]

Originally Posted by ozzy6900

The assigner handles all the dirty details in those cases.

This is exactly who should handle all the problems. Call the game and immediately leave the field and go home. If any procedures for money are not met, call the assignor and he should fix them including paying you the money immediately if some team stiffed you or tried to pay after the game. I have yet to hear of a pi$$ poor assignor. All the ones I have heard about have well paying day jobs and are making a nice stipend from the schools and teams and many charge umpires a fee to assign them also for their trouble.
Many assignors umpire games and many times get a lot (quantity and quality) of good games regardless of whether they are the best in their association or not. So let them pay you immediately when things go wrong, and this will solve all the problems. Believe me, if the assignor has to keep paying a lot of his umpires out of his own pocket (although many can well afford it) because teams are lax or tardy with paying the game fee on time, he will fix the problem (because it will be a pain in the a$$ for him just like it is for the umpires involved) including and up to, not booking that team with umpires any more. IMHO, put the responsibility where it belongs, on the assignor, who in many areas with many teams is handsomely paid. End of discussion.

[chartrusepengui]

Originally Posted by johnnyg08

I think on game day, the schools should hold the burden of calling/emailing the umpires...it shouldn't fall solely on the umpires...esp on game day...

In my area - if we don't receive a call cancelling in a timely manner - we get paid the contracted fee - w/ mileage. Timely manner means calculating the driving time - arriving at field 30 minutes prior to game time - plus 30 minutes. For example - if it takes 30 minutes to drive to field - we would have to be called at least 90 minutes prior to game time for us not to get paid. So far no problems - usually called in plenty of time. If game is cancelled for reasons other than weather - and they forget to call - we get paid. It is THEIR responsibility solely. We are not expected to keep track of all teams/schools.

[yawetag]

Originally Posted by tballump

This is exactly who should handle all the problems. Call the game and immediately leave the field and go home. If any procedures for money are not met, call the assignor and he should fix them including paying you the money immediately if some team stiffed you or tried to pay after the game.

This is moot through my organization. We're paid through the org, not at each individual school. I like it a lot better. I feel people, especially when the away team loses, tend to think things when you're handed a check at the game site.

One of the smaller leagues I ump for (away from the org) pays us cash for each game. We're most often paid in the office after the game, but one time the new president tried to hand me my pay on the field between innings. I politely declined and stated I would get it after the game.

[johnnyg08]

In amateur organizations, it's pretty common to get paid at the field and it's no mystery how umps are paid. your association doesn't get their money from the sky...you're still getting paid by the teams. anybody who's going to "think things" or "say things" about me being paid for umpiring because their team lost doesn't get 1 second of my time in the first place. Maybe it's different out your way. I'm glad that we don't get paid through our association.

[HokieUmp]

Originally Posted by yawetag

If this were a high school game in my association, you're screwed. It's our job to call the school and verify the game is still on before leaving for the game. If the game is still on, you get the name of the person and drive to the school. If the game gets canceled at any time after that, you're paid for the game.

Why should that fall on the umpire(s)? Isn't there a contract in place between the school/school district and the assignor?

Here, if it's a rain issue, we have a website that is updated - like today, for example, where most of our games were killed - or we can call the assignor, quickly give name and place, and he'll let us know.

If a game is killed for other reasons, it's still not on us to call around. Two years ago, my partner and I show up at a private school for a JV game. There are guys on the field, but it's an obvious practice situation - shorts and T-shirts. It's the varsity team, and the coach says "Yeah, XXXX got rid of their JV team this year, so the game was canceled."

Really? Thing is, it wasn't - since they didn't bother to tell the assignor, that game was still on the schedule, so they owed me and my partner a game fee. I'm thinking they've tightened up their process for canceled games a little since then.

[yawetag]

Originally Posted by HokieUmp

Why should that fall on the umpire(s)? Isn't there a contract in place between the school/school district and the assignor?

I don't involve myself with the contractual side of our organization. I'm assuming, however, the contract states that the school will pay a game fee if the game is canceled after the umpires call the school.

Originally Posted by HokieUmp

Here, if it's a rain issue, we have a website that is updated - like today, for example, where most of our games were killed - or we can call the assignor, quickly give name and place, and he'll let us know.

If the assigner knows, Arbiter is updated or a phone call is made by him. In instances where dozens of schools are canceling, how is he going to find time to not only field calls from all the schools but also call each umpire involved?

In the several games I've had canceled before leaving, only two were discovered by me when I made the phone call. The last one I had, the A.D. said "I just canceled the game and called [assigner]."

Originally Posted by HokieUmp

If a game is killed for other reasons, it's still not on us to call around. Two years ago, my partner and I show up at a private school for a JV game. There are guys on the field, but it's an obvious practice situation - shorts and T-shirts. It's the varsity team, and the coach says "Yeah, XXXX got rid of their JV team this year, so the game was canceled."

Really? Thing is, it wasn't - since they didn't bother to tell the assignor, that game was still on the schedule, so they owed me and my partner a game fee. I'm thinking they've tightened up their process for canceled games a little since then.

In my organization, you would have called the assigner. He would then ask, "Did you call the school before leaving for the game?" You would respond, "No, I didn't." At that point, you're screwed.

Had you called, you tell the assigner the name of the person you talked to, what time you called, and what they said. That information is passed to the school along with the bill.

I don't see how it's "calling around" either. We have one number to call; it's most often the A.D., his secretary, or an "activities hotline" number that's updated with the game status. The calls take no more than two minutes.

[johnnyg08]

The umpires shouldn't have the burden of calling the same hotline as the parents. If it works in your area...I guess it works...but I would never go for that here...nor would our other members

[DG]

Here, if no one calls you get half game fee to show up. Full game fee is only if the game gets started. I generally only call if weather conditions make me suspect the game is cancelled. I leave work to go to games so would rather not if game is not going to be played. If it is 7:00 game I call early because you will not get anyone past 3:00.

[zm1283]

Around here if you're on the way to the game when it gets axed, you get mileage. If you are at the game site and it gets washed, you get one game fee most of the time.

One association uses the Arbiter and it is updated 99% of the time when a cancellation happens. The other assigner puts cancellations on his answering machine as they come in. People know to call it and check before they leave. Both associations stress that when in doubt, call the school before you leave and check.

[amusedofficial]

Here is a situation I encountered this year. . Crew of two. AAUgly. Doubleheader, to be paid at field by coaches. We agree to be paid betwix games to get things rollling, no reason to believe we won't be paid. Since its two fees, one will take two game fees from one team, the other two from other team (yeah, bad idea for a lot of reasons, I concede that and move on). H wins Game One handily. I get paid betwix games by V. Game Two, first inning, two close calls go against V while they are at-bat, both by me. Coach yips about it, nothing unusual, he may have been right.. I move to cover first with bases empty, next to his bench and take usual abuse from moms and dads, which I find amusing since I have been in their situation where you pay a lot of coin for kids to do AAU programs and believe that gives you the right to blast officials all afternoon. Coach commiserates with moms and dads who each paid $2K in fees for inter alia, coaching fees and says: "I guess they want to get out of here (and call outs to move the game)" Not a terrible line by baseball standards, I'll live with it. Then C says "I shouldn't have paid them 'till we were through."

I ignored it. Ever since I have thought I should have dumped him as soon as that comment flew out of his mouth. This coach had previously pulled a kid off the field for *****ing and told him he was thru for the day because of it, so maybe I was giving him credit for respecting the game. I'm a rook at baseball, but have done hoops for years and would have slapped an instant T for a similar comment on the court, but was reluctant to chase the coach for one remark.

My question: Would you send the coach to the parking lot for this, warn him, or be stoic about it? My thought at the time was that it was steam-blowing and it was a one-liner (grandstanding to be sure) uttered off-field but within earshot and not worth taking the kids' coach away. On the other hand, I wonder if I put myself in a position of allowing my integrity to be questioned and should have dumped him immediately. Is the fact that I thought about it afterward a sign I should have dumped him? Is the fact that I even raise the question a sign that I should have dumped him?

[johnnyg08]

It might be construed as rabbit ears...but you don't have to care about that either...if you knew that he was intentionally saying it loud enough for you to hear, I suppose you could run him...but personally, for just that incident alone, I probably wouldn't eject.