tie goes to runner

[mwoods]

Is and in what rule book does it have the rule, "A tie goes to the runner?

[Jerry]

In baseball, there is no such things as a "tie". You can be "safe" or "out" by umpire judgement but it is impossible to judge a tie.

OBR is very specific as to when a batter is out. 6.02(j) . . . he or first base is tagged BEFORE he touches 1st base. I suppose that if you, as an umpire, determines that it was a virtual "tie" . . . (which is actually a physical impossibility under the laws of relativity), then you'd have to call the batter "safe". By inference, that could be interpreted as "A tie goes to the runner", but in actuality the judgement was made that the action was done either BEFORE or AFTER; not at the same time.

Jerry

[Rich Ives]

And on a force at any other base the runner has to touch the base BEFORE he is tagged, so there the "tie" goes to the fielder.

[brandda]

Ain't no such thing.

[greymule]

Very interesting question, and a lot of fun to think about. Here's my two cents:

The notion that there cannot be a tie is dependent on the notion that the moment the ball contacts the glove and the moment the runner's foot contacts the base can be defined such that they are infinitesimal points of time, that with perfect measuring equipment, the exact moment of contact could be defined as a unique instant. But it can't.

Perhaps with the best measuring devices, some sort of atomic stopwatches, ball-glove and foot-base moment of contact could be differentiated to a billionth of a second. Who knows?—maybe a trillionth. But obviously not an "infinitesmal" part of a second. And at the subatomic level, "moment of contact" begins to fall apart. If we stop-framed at a trillionth of a second and viewed such that electrons were the size of baseballs, "moment of contact" would be ambiguous. We could not say, "Aha! Right there! Foot touched base at frame number 889,268,141,006." Throw in relativity and the angle of the observer to the play, and the fact that the ball is moving faster than the runner could make the play look safe to one observer and out to another.

A similar philosophical-theoretical problem applies to the notion that no two raindrops hit the ground at exactly the same time. The question breaks down with the definition of "hit."

It would be interesting to know how accurate a human eye would be. Out by one second is out by a mile; you wouldn't even have to call it. I would guess that out by a tenth of a second would be close but clear. But how about a hundredth of a second? Certainly at some point not too far from there we'd have an apparent tie.

A friend of mine, a professor of aerospace engineering at Princeton, says he knows a theoretical physicist baseball fan who has written on the physics of baseball, things like just how much bat speed, weight, hardness, give, etc., affect distance. I think he says that if pitchers could get just a little more spin on their curve balls, the breaks would be much larger. Anyway, maybe that guy could be persuaded to write on the theoretics of ties.

In the meantime, maybe it's better to say, "Apparent tie goes to the runner."

[jicecone]

Sorry guys. Your all wrong!


TIE GOES TO THE UMPIRE!

And I know what Im calling.

[kylejt]

Ha! I'm using that in my pre-game for ToC this weekend.

"Ok boys, we all know that ties go to the umpire, and today's tie-breaker is the number of GLM's in your bleachers. Have a good game, and help your catchers on with their gear".

Manager to coach "Quick Larry, get out the rule book from the bottom of the ball bucket and look up GLM, it must be some new tournament rule."

Kyle

[jicecone]

Ah, I almost forgot the pleasure of doing Little League.

GLM'sss

[brandda]

While I find the GLM thread to be hilarious, let's be careful here. Just a couple of weeks ago we had a thread on why there were not more female umpires. Can't have it both ways.

[jicecone]

Hey I just noticed Im a Senior Member, someone must of found out.

Your right brandda. I apologize if taken the wrong way but, somethings are just beautiful in nature and I enjoy myself at every game. It just so happens that sometimes LL is more enjoyable than other times.

[bluezebra]

Originally posted by brandda
While I find the GLM thread to be hilarious, let's be careful here. Just a couple of weeks ago we had a thread on why there were not more female umpires. Can't have it both ways.

Don't take things for granted. Some might think GLM means "Good Looking Male".

Bob

[Jerry]

Actually, on Father's Day, more ties go to fathers than anyone else. So, if a runner is a father, then in reality, ties do go to the runner.

Hawaian Shirts, on the other hand, go to the fielders.

[jumpmaster]

greymule, you should get out more.

GLMs, the one good thing about parents at ballgames.

[snrmike]

Try this idea...

A baseball partner and long-time friend suggests this to all of the umpire recruits at our clinics:

"The runner is either coming to a base or going away from the base."

The rules are clear - as always, but sometimes quoting a specific rules isn't too helpful on a banger at first in a tight game. I use this philosophy almost as a religious mantra when working the bases, and it hasn't failed me - yet!

This is especially useful in any ballgame where the bases are closer than 90 feet and the runners a little faster.

I use the GLM count only as a secondary approach.

[Tim C]

The definition of "Getting Old", as an umpire, is that when working a high school game, you no longer notice the high school girls, you instead notice the GLM's.

So Sad!