Offensive players cheering their team in foul territory

[spots101]

Regional game tonight: High throw from right field to third goes into home field dugout. Most of the players are out in foul territory cheering on their teammates. I couldn't see if the ball actually hit any of them or not. Anyway, ump gives 2 base award. The question is, should the ump penalize the players for being in foul territory or not (seeing as how this kind of thing happens a lot, the cheering that is) especially since the dugout had no fence right in front of it. If there is a penalty does the ball have to actually hit a kid or just in close proximity since they are in foul territory? Either way what would you call? Thanks for your help.

[brandda]

What were they doing out of the dugout while the ball was in play? Or was there no dugout?

[spots101]

They were out of the dugout cheering on their teammate because he had just hit a double in the top of the 7th and it (the double) scored a run. The "dugout" is a typical above-the-ground structure with no fence or barrier of any type in front of it whatsoever, which is why most of the players were easily gathered in foul territory during the celebration.

[soonerfan]

Originally posted by spots101
Regional game tonight: High throw from right field to third goes into home field dugout. Most of the players are out in foul territory cheering on their teammates. I couldn't see if the ball actually hit any of them or not. Anyway, ump gives 2 base award. The question is, should the ump penalize the players for being in foul territory or not (seeing as how this kind of thing happens a lot, the cheering that is) especially since the dugout had no fence right in front of it. If there is a penalty does the ball have to actually hit a kid or just in close proximity since they are in foul territory? Either way what would you call? Thanks for your help.

Depends on a few things. First, you say foul territory but how much space is there? I have been to places where there is maybe 10 feet and some that have 40 feet. If they are out so far that they are producing and obstruction of play then I might say something. On the other hand, the ground rules for the dugouts with no fencing should have been clarified at the plate meeting. Some dugouts have a 5' area in front of the dugout that some coaches will allow the players to on during a game, and some that ask that the players remain inside at all times. Tough call, I would say I might look at where these players were. Whomever does not like the call can blame it on the gaff in the plate meeting. JOHN

[brandda]

Well, I am not sure if it matters if it hit a player or not. The two base award comes from the ball going into the dugout, not from it hitting a player.

[Marty Rogers]

If no fielder had made an attempt to
catch this errant throw that brought
him into the group of cheerers, then I
would let the play stand. It sounds
like the ball sailed over 3B and no
fielder could have gotten to it or
tried to anyway.

There truly was no interference if this is
the case. You could rule interference if
these players didn't vacate space needed
by the offense to field a batted or
thrown ball. Rule 7.11

I think that the ball hitting one of the
kids, or not, is irrevelant, since it
went into DBT (dugout). Judge by
what the fielders(s) did.

After that play, I would instruct the players
to stay inside the dugout and cheer from there.

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by spots101
Regional game tonight: High throw from right field to third goes into home field dugout. Most of the players are out in foul territory cheering on their teammates. I couldn't see if the ball actually hit any of them or not. Anyway, ump gives 2 base award. The question is, should the ump penalize the players for being in foul territory or not (seeing as how this kind of thing happens a lot, the cheering that is) especially since the dugout had no fence right in front of it. If there is a penalty does the ball have to actually hit a kid or just in close proximity since they are in foul territory? Either way what would you call? Thanks for your help.

I assume this is a game played under FED rules.

Somewhere, there's a case play dealing with a ball that hits equipment that was (improperly) left outside the dugout. The umpire can award bases, or outs, or let the play stand based on his judgment.

I'd apply the same ruling here (with the benefit of any doubt given to the team that wasn't out of the dugout).

[spots101]

Thanks guys for your comments. To me the players were not interfering at all they were just out of the dugout a few feet cheering the hit. I personally would not have ruled interference based on the poor throw and the fact that the offensive team wasn't doing anything wrong (technically). I just saw it as an attempt by the opposing coach, who was down 5 runs, to gain some ground. It reminds me of a similar situation a few years back when the Blackhawks were on the brink of playoff elimination and the coach wanted to stick of the opposing goalie measured to see if it was within regulation (length). Yes this was a FED game.