Thanks Brian

[JR12]

[QUOTE=He was then tagged by the catcher before his trail leg touched the plate (the only leg that touched the plate)."[/QUOTE]




I dont want to argue, but I would disagree. Also I don't think Brian is a poor Umpire, he may have blown one and it went in my teams favor. $h1t happens! Check out the pics my son got from the video, it appears the runners foot is on the plate(at least to me).But the beauty of baseball is that nobody had a better view than Brian.



http://www.freewebs.com/cadet13/apps...lbumID=1723548

[SanDiegoSteve]

Not very good images are they? It's hard to determine from there. In the video, it sure looked like his leg came in higher, above the plate. Are you sure that the pictures weren't edited with Photoshop?

[SanDiegoSteve]

And, as I stated before, umpires miss calls occasionally.

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by JR12

Does anyone think Brian was a little too close on both those plays at the plate?

I think that the fan with the broken nose is more important than worrying about this call!

[JR12]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Not very good images are they? It's hard to determine from there. In the video, it sure looked like his leg came in higher, above the plate. Are you sure that the pictures weren't edited with Photoshop?

My 15 y/o son paused the video to get the images. (beyond my expertiece) The only editing was a little cropping of the edges. Everbody misses one once in a while.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by msavakinas

Beg to differ. He kicked the call. Get off his jock just because you know him. We understand that. I honestly think that Marty Brennaman is right and it's not a coincidence that sh!t happens every time he's behind the dish.

All three of his ejections have been his fault because he screwed up.

I'm not sniffing his jock at all. I know him, but we're not buddies or anything. I call sh!t either as it is or as I see it. From looking at the crappy video on MLB and the crappy still photos I've seen, I can't really tell if the plate is being touched.

And then there is the fact that twice I mentioned that umpires miss calls, which is to say "get over it." So, I twice admitted the possibility of a blown call. But from what I saw, it looked like his leg was in the air. I'm not defending Runge on a personal level, just basing it on what I saw in the crappy video clip.

The ejections were deemed to have been on correct calls by an independant source. I'm not making anything up. Plus, Manuel had no business coming out, and I would have run him much sooner myself, like as soon as he started arguing balls and strikes. Runge takes too much crap, IMO. And he tried to keep motormouth Beltran in the game, but the little pendejo couldn't keep his boca shut. Runge gave him chance after chance to pipe down, and just couldn't do it.

And as far as jock straps go, Brennaman couldn't hold Vin Scully's or Harry Kalas'. Highly overrated. Boy, oh boy!

[FTVMartin]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Runge was not too close, as it was a tag play. You are supposed to be close to tag plays. He was in perfect position on 3BLX and correctly ascertained that the runner's front leg crossed over the plate without touching it. He was then tagged by the catcher before his trail leg touched the plate (the only leg that touched the plate).

Only a real homer (mmm...unexplained bacon) would argue this. Polanco gave up his argument quickly, as he knew he didn't really touch the plate, and no manager came out to get ejected, as you would have thought.

"

Watch it again. He was clearly safe. His foot wasn't even in the air. Leyland got it right after the game when he said umpires make mistakes but that isn't why we lost. We had a 6-0 lead and the umps didn't cost us the game.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by msavakinas

Marty is the man... lol And he is right here. It's just an observation.

Spoken like a loyal fan

Originally Posted by msavakinas

Umm the independent source might be that umpire fantasy league site you referred to a couple weeks ago?? Not exactly credible... They also said that Andy Fletcher kicked the call where he dumped Sciosca a couple weeks ago. Not the case sir.

Here is the quotation of the story, so what part are you saying isn't the case?

HP Umpire Andy Fletcher ejected Angels Manager Mike Scioscia for arguing a foul ball call in the top of the 5th inning of the Angels-Rangers game. With one out and none on, Angels second baseman Howie Kendrick took a 1-2 fastball inside, the pitch deflecting off to the side of home plate. Fletcher called the pitch a foul ball, while Kendrick held his right elbow, claiming that the pitch hit him. Scioscia came out to argue, and after a discussion with Fletcher, returned to the dugout. After the next pitch, a foul ball, Fletcher turned to the Angels dugout and ejected Scioscia. Replays show that the pitch clearly hit Kendrick on the right elbow, the call was incorrect.

Originally Posted by msavakinas

He should have balked the Brewers pitcher in his first ejection. Brendan Harris stepped out and the Brewers pitcher balked because of it. It should have been no pitch because a batter cannot cause the pitcher to balk. Instead he rang up Brendan Harris and ended up ejecting Gardenhire.

I remember seeing this play on Sports Center. Gardernhire was ejected for arguing balls and strikes. There was no balk on the play. Harris stepped out without being granted Time, so the pitch was called by location. Here is what happened on the play exactly.

HP Umpire Brian Runge ejected Twins Manager Ron Gardenhire for arguing a called third strike in the top of the 8th inning of the Twins-Brewers game. With none out and none on, Twins shortstop Brendan Harris was called out on three strikes on an 0-2 fastball from Brewers pitcher Guillermo Mota. Harris had tried to call timeout before the pitch but was not granted time by Runge. Major League Baseball recently sent a point of emphasis to all umpires regarding the pace of the game; one of these points discourages the granting of time to a batter asking for it when the pitcher has already started his motion. Replays show that Mota had already begun his motion when Harris asked for time and the pitch was located over the heart of the plate, the call was correct.

Originally Posted by msavakinas

The second time the pitch was a strike, but he should not have stepped out like he did in front of Beltran. He should've said something with his mask on or went out and dusted off the plate and said something under his breath, just like Beltran was doing to him. Now if Beltran said enough to get tossed with his head down, he should've tossed him right away. He also bumped into Manuel... if they can't do it why can we?? And he paid his price for it with a night off and got paid for it.

Do you have documentation that says he got paid? That doesn't seem fair.

So what, he bumped Manuel? How many times have coaches bumped you? Well, when you've umpired for awhile longer you can answer that. The answer is that it happens. Arguments get heated. People touch. Oooooh, a bump...let's cry about it. It's not like he hauled off and punched him, come on. Haven't you seen video of the "pine tar" incident with George Brett. Look at all the bumping and wrestling that went on between Brett and the umpires. And on top of that, Runge apologized to Manuel for the bump. That still doesn't make coming out to argue balls and strikes right, nor does it make the bumping right. Manuel should have been ran long before any bumping could have occurred.

And Beltran was not talking "under his breath." What a crock! He turned his head and was jawing with Runge and putting on a show of disrespect. If he had kept his head down and truly spoken under his breath, nobody would have even known he was arguing, and that might have been the end of it. Runge got tired of the mouthiness and had a little talk with the guy while cleaning the plate. Why should he keep his mask on? I always remove my mask to clean the plate, why should anyone else do differently. When you keep your mask on, it dangles when you bend over. It only makes sense to remove it when cleaning the plate. And then, the discussion was over, and everything would have been okay, but Runge stands up from brushing the plate, and Manuel is right there in his face, where he doesn't belong. Where did he belong? Why, back in the dugout, that's where.

Originally Posted by msavakinas

There it is. He screwed the pooch both times when he did the tossing.

Apparently not. Only problem was in the way he handled the Mets situation. Too lenient and wanted to argue way too much. He should have just dumped them.

Originally Posted by msavakinas

Umpires miss calls. The point is he is at that level to get them right and shouldn't miss a call like the one in tigers game. He is supposed to be the example for the rest of us to learn from.

When I worked with him, I was the seasoned veteran and he was the raw rookie! He should have learned from me.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by FTVMartin

Watch it again. He was clearly safe. His foot wasn't even in the air. Leyland got it right after the game when he said umpires make mistakes but that isn't why we lost. We had a 6-0 lead and the umps didn't cost us the game.

I can't seem to get but one quick look at it from a horrible angle, the thing takes forever to load on this dinosaur computer of mine, and the action is choppy and broken up. I know I must be missing some critical part of it, because I swear he looks like his leg is elevated.

I don't really care one way or the other. The only view I've had was on this crappy little video clip, so I am probably wrong.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by msavakinas

I'm not saying it was a foul ball, and neither was Fletcher. He said that Kendrick moved into the pitch. Which by starting to swing (even though it wasn't an actual swing) he did. Which is the correct call. Look at the video on link below and you'll see I'm correct. Just search "eject" and you'll find it eventually.

How do you get that being the correct call? If the batter did not strike at the ball, it's a hit by pitch. The fact that he was "moving into the pitch" is irrelevant unless he intentionally tried to get hit. Is that what Fletcher ruled, that Kendrick tried to get hit? What does the press release say about the play? Did Fletcher call dead ball strike or foul? My only detailed source said foul ball, and they closely investigate these things for accuracy's sake. If it "wasn't an actual swing," and the ball was not in the strike zone, and the batter did not intentionally allow the pitched ball to touch him, it's a HBP.

Originally Posted by msavakinas

Replays also show Mota paused momentarily while coming the plate with his left foot. He stopped and restarted. Watch it and you'll see it around 1:49, although it was never mentioned.

http://mlb.mlb.com/media/video.jsp

search "gardenhire" and it's video #2.

Then it should not have been a balk, it should have been nothing and start over from scratch, as both batter and pitcher violated a rule. 6.02(b) Comment.

I will try to get these videos to play properly, but there is no way of spooling the clips to get them to run in real time on my slow machine, so usually it's a real PIA to do.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by msavakinas

The rulebook begs to differ. 6.08 (b) reads: He is touched by a pitched ball which he is not attempting to hit unless (1) The ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, or (2) The batter makes no attempt to avoid being touched by the ball;

Fletcher did not speak to the press about the incident, as it had no bearing on the outcome of the game. He called it a dead ball "ball." It wasn't an actual swing. The batter did not make an attempt to avoid being touched, in fact he moved into the way of the pitch. Intentional or unintentional he's stayin at the plate.

This what you said. Take note of the bold area:

"I'm not saying it was a foul ball, and neither was Fletcher. He said that Kendrick moved into the pitch. Which by starting to swing (even though it wasn't an actual swing) he did. Which is the correct call. Look at the video on link below and you'll see I'm correct. Just search "eject" and you'll find it eventually."

When a batter starts to swing at the pitch and checks his swing, it is not the same as not making an attempt to avoid the pitch. If you start to swing and check, and the ball hits you, it's a HBP. Now, I may not know everything, but I know that. I would NEVER call "dead ball - ball" on a checked swing. The batter only has to make an attempt to avoid a pitch if it is clear he has time to do so. If he starts to strike at the ball, and it is NOT in the strike zone, and the ball hits him, it is a HIT BY PITCH, and the batter is not penalized as he would be if he just stuck his body in front of the pitch. If you call something like that anything but a HBP, you will get laughed out of the yard, dude. He has to intentionally allow the ball to strike him, regardless of the wording in 6.08. In fact, the wording is "which he is not attempting to strike at." That's what a checked swing is; he was at first attempting to strike at the ball, then thought better of it and checked his swing. That is not what 6.08(b) is referring to.

Originally Posted by msavakinas

Look at my previous posts. I said this numerous times. Even on the thread that was just pertaining to this incident.

This is what you said: "He should have balked the Brewers pitcher in his first ejection. Brendan Harris stepped out and the Brewers pitcher balked because of it. It should have been no pitch because a batter cannot cause the pitcher to balk. Instead he rang up Brendan Harris and ended up ejecting Gardenhire."

You said "he should have balked the Brewers [sic] pitcher." No, he should not have. That was my point.

[canadaump6]

What is the definition of jock sniffers anyways?

[Ump153]

Originally Posted by canadaump6

What is the definition of jock sniffers anyways?

Jock Sniffer
(n) one who associates with or obsessively and publicly keeps track of the daily habits and activities of professional athletes or officials, thinking this will make them higher on the social food chain.

See: Goyanksgonj

[zebra2955]

All you people asking for a balk on Runge's game . I think I see one too but was he working by himself? Did not any of the other umps see this balk too? You can bash Runge all you want but somebody else could have called it too.
So I guess they all kicked the mutt on that one too.