2008 HOF Ballot

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by Publius

Not only would I not vote for Gossage and Smith, I'd kick out Sutter, Fingers and Eckersley. "I can get four guys out every other day" isn't HOF stuff.

I think you are over-simplifying the role of the closer in baseball. As if other people could actually do what these guys can do. Closers belong in the Hall of Fame as much as any starter does. Some teams would have never even gotten a sniff of the playoffs, much less gone to the World Series, without the players you just mentioned.

Padres fans like myself are very thankful that we have Trevor Hoffman as our most valuable asset every year, saving over 500 games over his career. And I remember 1984 as if it were yesterday, and Goose Gossage sure pulled our bacon out of the fire on many occassions. Same with Rollie Fingers. Sutter, Eckersly...how can you even blaspheme their names by wanting to kick them out of the HOF? Where would the Cardinals have been without them?

It's a good thing that we don't have any say-so in this voting, because some of us are awfully critical of some very deserving players.

[mattmets]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Padres fans like myself are very thankful that we have Trevor Hoffman as our most valuable asset every year, saving over 500 games over his career. And I remember 1984 as if it were yesterday, and Goose Gossage sure pulled our bacon out of the fire on many occassions. Same with Rollie Fingers. Sutter, Eckersly...how can you even blaspheme their names by wanting to kick them out of the HOF? Where would the Cardinals have been without them?

The Cardinals would have been in the same place there are now, with the exception of Sutter

Just pulling your chain....saying relievers don't belong is like saying DHs don't belong- it's not naming the best players of all-time, just the ones that made the greatest impact/contribution to the game on the field.

[canadaump6]

Taken from the Official MLB stats page:

Knoblauch had a career on base percentage of .378. Batting average is way over-rated. A hit is more beneficial than a walk only when there is a runner in scoring position.

[dash_riprock]

Knoblauch also struck out almost as often as he walked.

[waltjp]

Originally Posted by dash_riprock

Knoblauch also struck out almost as often as he walked.

Chuck Knoblauch

Career Hits - 1839
Career K's - 730

Roughly 2 1/2 hits per strikeout

[DonInKansas]

Originally Posted by waltjp

Chuck Knoblauch

Career Hits - 1839
Career K's - 730

Roughly 2 1/2 hits per strikeout

He said walk, not hit.

[waltjp]

Originally Posted by DonInKansas

He said walk, not hit.

Yup. Ya got me.

[waltjp]

Originally Posted by canadaump6

Taken from the Official MLB stats page:

Knoblauch had a career on base percentage of .378. Batting average is way over-rated. A hit is more beneficial than a walk only when there is a runner in scoring position.

Guess you're not counting extra-base hits.

[dash_riprock]

Originally Posted by canadaump6

Taken from the Official MLB stats page:

Knoblauch had a career on base percentage of .378. Batting average is way over-rated. A hit is more beneficial than a walk only when there is a runner in scoring position.

Not even close to being in the top 100. And that's all you can say about him? He doesn't belong on this list. Jason Giambi has a higher OBP.

[Publius]

Relievers are eligible for my HOF; I just can't find one I'd vote for. What they contribute relative to position players and starting pitchers isn't HOF worthy. If a guy spends his career as a DH, I'd never vote for him, either.

Now, Steve, I know you're going to disagree, but your claim that teams wouldn't have gotten to the playoffs is sheer speculation. It can't be proven or disproven. True in some cases, not in others. I'd be more impressed with saves if the rule granting one weren't so liberal. Two outs, last inning. Reliever comes in with a three-run lead and a runner on first. He gives up a two-run shot, then a double before the next guy flies out to the warning track. Save. Joke.

How many saves are granted to closers after set-up guys and middle relievers do the heavy lifting? R1, R2, no outs. Set-up guy strikes out two batters, then closer comes in, walks a batter and retires the next one. Save. Joke.

The save is the most overrated stat in baseball. I'm curious as to how many would be granted under a different condition: you don't get one unless you enter the game with the tying run in scoring position (not on deck). If a guy chalked up 300 of THOSE in a career, I'd vote to put him in the HOF.

[umpduck11]

Tawny Kitaen belongs in the Hall before Chuck Finley. After all, look at all the hits she got on him.........

[kylejt]

Originally Posted by Publius

...you don't get one unless you enter the game with the tying run in scoring position (not on deck).

Hey, Trevor Hoffman nearly always puts the tying run on base. Does that count?

[SanDiegoSteve]

I guess the lesson learned here is that a bunch of umpires who post on the internet is not the best group from which to base who should go into the Hall.

[Publius]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

I guess the lesson learned here is that a bunch of umpires who post on the internet is not the best group from which to base who should go into the Hall.

No doubt. Particularly the ones who seem to have but a single criterion:

"Did you take steroids? You didn't? OK, you're in."