Randy Marsh calling strikes

[jimpiano]

Originally Posted by jicecone

I also heard the same thing and assumed that was what was said considering how they doctor up the sounds for TV. (Eg. Each pitch has some sound added to it, like the swish of the wind. Maybe it was just my ears though.)

Say what?

How in the world can any technology "doctor" sounds in a live event"?

That is called EDTING, but, to do that, it first has to be recorded.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by jimpiano

Say what?

How in the world can any technology "doctor" sounds in a live event"?

That is called EDTING, but, to do that, it first has to be recorded.

Not true.

They can, for example as the PGA does, direct a microphone to pick up a particular sound. (The swing and impact on tee shots)

They can run that signal through the board and "sweeten" it or alter it in, depending on the technology they are using, thousands of ways. Live. Right now. As it happens.

[jimpiano]

Originally Posted by GarthB

Not true.

They can, for example as the PGA does, direct a microphone to pick up a particular sound. (The swing and impact on tee shots)

They can run that signal through the board and "sweeten" it or alter it in, depending on the technology they are using, thousands of ways. Live. Right now. As it happens.

Mikes of course can be directed at an audio source, the cup and tee in golf, the net in basketball, etc. But those sounds cannot be alterted on a live broadcast....enhanced in volume,,,but not altered...and certainly no umpire's strike call can be changed to something it is not.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by jimpiano

Mikes of course can be directed at an audio source, the cup and tee in golf, the net in basketball, etc. But those sounds cannot be alterted on a live broadcast....enhanced in volume,,,but not altered...and certainly no umpire's strike call can be changed to something it is not.

Oh, my gawd.

You are either living in the 1950's, technologically retarded or purposefully misrepresenting the truth,

Sounds can and often are altered on live broadcasts, in real time. I have seen it first hand as part of my job with a symphony orchestra and I know it to be done in many other situations. It is not difficult to tamper or alter a live sound as it goes through the board.

Some time back the NBA sweetened the sound of the basketball going through the net with a "popping sound" during live broadcasts and he NFL added an impact sound plus a swishing sound to hocky games.

Live broadcasted concerts often have additional tracks added to the live track to give the music that "studio" presence rather than the comparatively thin sound live performances often have.

It would no problem no alter an umpire's verbalization as he makes it. The decision as to what sound to use is made before the broadcast and the line carrying the umpire's voice is fed into a pre set board.

If you don't understand this simple technology, you should step back away from your computer or the magical spirits that make the pictures appear might get angry.

[waltjp]

Originally Posted by GarthB

Oh, my gawd.

You are either living in the 1950's, technologically retarded or purposefully misrepresenting the truth,

Sounds can and often are altered on live broadcasts, in real time. I have seen it first hand as part of my job with a symphony orchestra and I know it to be done in many other situations. It is not difficult to tamper or alter a live sound as it goes through the board.

Some time back the NBA sweetened the sound of the basketball going through the net with a "popping sound" during live broadcasts and he NFL added an impact sound plus a swishing sound to hocky games.

Live broadcasted concerts often have additional tracks added to the live track to give the music that "studio" presence rather than the comparatively thin sound live performances often have.

It would no problem no alter an umpire's verbalization as he makes it. The decision as to what sound to use is made before the broadcast and the line carrying the umpire's voice is fed into a pre set board.

If you don't understand this simple technology, you should step back away from your computer or the magical spirits that make the pictures appear might get angry.

I immediately thought of the swishing sound from hockey games. The problem is that Jim believes that 'live' means instantaneous. Not true, of course. Ever see a live broadcast that's been closed captioned?

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by waltjp

I immediately thought of the swishing sound from hockey games. The problem is that Jim believes that 'live' means instantaneous. Not true, of course. Ever see a live broadcast that's been closed captioned?

I can do it instaneously as well. I can set a trumpeter on stage in front of a live audience, have him play into a microphone and have the sound of a saxophone come out the speakers....instantaneously.

I can have jimbopyana speak into a microphone and have the sound of a jackass braying come out of the speakers instead of his, no doubt, mellifluous voice.

I can set up a mic to capture the sound of a baseball bat hitting the ball and altering it to a cat screaming, right now, this mini-second, as it occurs, immediately, before the swing is complete.

[jimpiano]

Originally Posted by GarthB

I can do it instaneously as well. I can set a trumpeter on stage in front of a live audience, have him play into a microphone and have the sound of a saxophone come out the speakers....instantaneously.

I can have jimbopyana speak into a microphone and have the sound of a jackass braying come out of the speakers instead of his, no doubt, mellifluous voice.

I can set up a mic to capture the sound of a baseball bat hitting the ball and altering it to a cat screaming, right now, this mini-second, as it occurs, immediately, before the swing is complete.

Well good for you.

But TV does not change sounds.

And it certainly does not alter the voice of Randy Marsh as he calls strikes.

You may be a bang up audio man for live musicial productions where creativity is part of the artistic process. But sports broadcasts are about giving the viewer the sounds of the game as heard by those in attendance.

[waltjp]

Originally Posted by GarthB

I can do it instaneously as well. I can set a trumpeter on stage in front of a live audience, have him play into a microphone and have the sound of a saxophone come out the speakers....instantaneously.

I can have jimbopyana speak into a microphone and have the sound of a jackass braying come out of the speakers instead of his, no doubt, mellifluous voice.

I can set up a mic to capture the sound of a baseball bat hitting the ball and altering it to a cat screaming, right now, this mini-second, as it occurs, immediately, before the swing is complete.

We agree and I'm arguing semantics. It can be perceived as instantaneous but there is a lot going on between the time you receive your input signal and the time that the final audio is ready for broadcast. Of course, we're talking about high-speed processors that can accomplish these feats in milliseconds but just because we can't detect it doesn't mean it's not happening.

[jimpiano]

Originally Posted by waltjp

I immediately thought of the swishing sound from hockey games. The problem is that Jim believes that 'live' means instantaneous. Not true, of course. Ever see a live broadcast that's been closed captioned?

Close captioning is done by feeding the scripts the announcers read to the close captioning video source or by someone actually typing the words they hear.

What that has to do with altering sounds I do not understand.

Live closed captioning always has some lag time, because the person has to hear the dialogue and then type it. It's very similar to court reporting, equipment-wise. The only time closed captioning doesn't have lag time is on pre-recorded shows or movies, when the captioner has access to the script. Even then, the captioning doesn't show all the words from the dialogue whereas in live captioning, the poor soul is trying to type EVERY word.

[DG]

Originally Posted by jimpiano

Mikes of course can be directed at an audio source, the cup and tee in golf, the net in basketball, etc. But those sounds cannot be alterted on a live broadcast....enhanced in volume,,,but not altered...and certainly no umpire's strike call can be changed to something it is not.

With not much effort I believe the umpire's first strike call could be recorded and replaced thereafter on a live broadcast with "BULLSH*T", if one was so inclined to do so. Computers man, computers.

[jimpiano]

Originally Posted by DG

With not much effort I believe the umpire's first strike call could be recorded and replaced thereafter on a live broadcast with "BULLSH*T", if one was so inclined to do so. Computers man, computers.

Well, there is certainly that.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by DG

With not much effort I believe the umpire's first strike call could be recorded and replaced thereafter on a live broadcast with "BULLSH*T", if one was so inclined to do so. Computers man, computers.

I just got off the phone with a friend who works for a CBS affiliate who provides production assistance at west coast events. He confirmed they sweeten the audio from the tee mic... "slightly, but not unnaturally" according to him. He stated that they alter the sound to match what "viewers expect to hear.'

"The natural sound of a golf swing, even a pro's does not coincide with the visual perception of the power of the swing. We make the swing and the contact with the ball sound more powerful."

He will send me an email in the AM and I'll cut and paste it here. He'll address the crowd noise issue as well.

I may have to take the pyana man off the ignore list long enough to see if he's still covering his ears and singning la la la la la la la la la.

Edited to add: Yep...he is.

[jimpiano]

Originally Posted by GarthB

I just got off the phone with a friend who works for a CBS affiliate who provides production assistance at west coast events. He confirmed they sweeten the audio from the tee mic... "slightly, but not unnaturally" according to him. He will send me an email in the AM and I'll cut and paste it here.

LOL


"slightly, but not unnaturally"

So a swoosh becomes a swoooosh?

A kiss is still a kisss?

Randy Marsh's strike beomes a strikee?

LOL

Tell me, when you were in the ESPN truck were you there to empty the trash? Or the "sweetened gar bage' ?

LOL

[GarthB]

You should change you name from jimpiano to some other instrument. A lyre would be good.

It’s amazing what you’ve learned in your thirty years of broadcast:

From post #6:

"How in the world can any technology "doctor" sounds in a live event"?
That is called EDTING, but, to do that, it first has to be recorded."

At first a total ignorance of the capability of audio technology, which you displayed again in post #9

"But those sounds cannot be alterted on a live broadcast."

Then you seem to accept that it could be done, but insisted that it was never done:

"But TV does not change sounds.
…sports broadcasts are about giving the viewer the sounds of the game as heard by those in attendance."

In post 17 you insisted again that broadcasters would never alter sounds at a sporting event:

"The sounds heard at home may be easier to hear , but they are the same sounds you would hear being close to the action at a live event. They are never altered or changed."

Finally, in post 22 you admitted the existence but denied the utilization:

"Ah, the capability exists. Certainly it does, but it is not used to change the sounds of the game."

"The swoosh at the tee is what you would hear standing next to Tiger."

In post 23 you told us:

"I can tell you for a fact that no American network broadcast alters or changes the actual sounds heard at an event."

Finally, you joke that the alterations that exist are basically meaningless.

What a wonderful route you took from being completely wrong to justifying being completely wrong.

Then, you sarcastically asked:

"Tell me, when you were in the ESPN truck were you there to empty the trash? Or the "sweetened gar bage' ?"

Well, unlike you, I stick to the truth. I never said I was in the truck. I said I worked at live events with ESPN. I remained at the event site and communicated with the truck.

But, regardless…it seems that I learned more working two events than you did in 30 years. Tomorrow I’ll post Larry's email and I'll ask him to use small words so you can keep up.