Stance

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by PWL

This reminds me of the line from Blazing Saddles. "Gentlemen, we have to protect our phony baloney jobs.

I've seen too many actions contradict too many statements. You need to come up with a better excuse than that.

Paul,

So you're saying that Hensley has a "phony baloney job?"

I thought he might be in a good position to work with you and then recommend you to the higher ups.

That would be taking positive action, which I believe, works better than whining.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by PWL

Leroy,

You're missing the point. I don't need anybody to work with me. I just know what I see and what I hear. I'm only saying that there is only so much pie to go around and some people don't get to sit at the table it is being served at. They're not going to serve smaller portions to ensure everyone gets a piece. AFAIK, Dave isn't umpiring this year because of work commitments. He might not even have made a meeting, but I am willing to bet some one signed his name to the sign in sheet. I've seen guys sign in for three people before. You have to make so many meeting to be eligible for playoffs. Plus, there are other things I will not go into.

Let's just say things aren't as kosher as they should be.

Paul,

So you're accusing Dave of being involved in cheating, plus some other things you "will not go into."

I'm amazed. I've never known Dave to be anything less than honest, even when we disagree.

[Dave Hensley]

Originally Posted by GarthB

Paul,

So you're accusing Dave of being involved in cheating, plus some other things you "will not go into."

I'm amazed. I've never known Dave to be anything less than honest, even when we disagree.

Hey guys. I've been absent from this forum for a couple of weeks. As PWL mentioned, I didn't take a high school schedule this year due to a change in my job situation that has me traveling frequently and on short notice. I made the first few meetings of the year, but when it came time to fish or cut bait on committing to my availability to get a schedule, I cut bait.

I think PWL is referring to a perception of "good ol' boy" politics in the association he and I are members of. What I know is that the same handful of veterans have held most of the officer positions for a long time. My opinion is that that is really just a reflection of the 80/20 rule - 20% of the people in any volunteer organization end up doing 80% of the work, rather than any conscious effort on their part to exclude new blood from coming in.

Most playoff assignments are the result of coaches' requests, a practice I find somewhat peculiar but not particularly sinister. It does, though, I think make it tougher for the newer umpires to gain the necessary familiarity to get playoff assignment requests.

As for PWL's speculation that some members are skirting the meeting attendance rules without penalty, I think he's probably right. There are over 100 association members, but rarely are there more than 30-40 at any given meeting. The sign-in sheet is basically on the honor system, so he may be right that some guys are getting ghost-signed in without attending. I have never asked anyone to sign me in, nor have I ever signed in someone else.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by Dave Hensley

I think PWL is referring to a perception of "good ol' boy" politics in the association he and I are members of. What I know is that the same handful of veterans have held most of the officer positions for a long time. My opinion is that that is really just a reflection of the 80/20 rule - 20% of the people in any volunteer organization end up doing 80% of the work, rather than any conscious effort on their part to exclude new blood from coming in.

I agree that the 80/20 rule is probably in play in more situations than any sinister motive.

Most playoff assignments are the result of coaches' requests, a practice I find somewhat peculiar but not particularly sinister. It does, though, I think make it tougher for the newer umpires to gain the necessary familiarity to get playoff assignment requests.

So if an umpire isn't getting playoff assignments, it's due to the what the coaches who he has had think about him and not exclusion by the "big dogs." Interesting.

[RPatrino]

Coach's providing feedback is important, but having them select who works the playoffs is a bit much.

What should be more important, the opinions of coach's or the respect of your peers?

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

Coach's providing feedback is important, but having them select who works the playoffs is a bit much.

What should be more important, the opinions of coach's or the respect of your peers?

Too many cons outweigh the pros.

Even if the coaches knew enough about mechanics, rules, and game management to make an intelligent decision, there would still be the matter of which umpires the coaches have seen through the season.

We told American Legion we would no longer work their games when the commissioner insisted on having approval of which of our members worked Legion games. He dropped that demand.

[jkumpire]

In my little association, I might be considerd "a big dog". Not that I am a great umpire or anything (though I think I am great umpire), but I spend 12 months a year on umpiring, and I do a lot of work in my local association, like teaching new umpires and etc.

So here is what I have to say to you:

1. The ultimate test of umpiring is the "mirror test". Can you look at yourself in the mirror the day after a game and say you did the best you can for those kids you umpired. That means are you the best umpire you can be with your "skill set"? If yes, then who really cares what anyone else thinks.

2. If you don't get any tournament games, who cares? If you pass the mirror test, then you are in good shape. There are some great umpires in my area who should be doing State Finals in baseball, and are better IMO than a lot of guys who are getting the games. For whatever reason, they don't get them. Many times it has nothing to do with politics, or anything else. Life isn't always fair.

3. I may be a big dog who baseball has passed by, but I see a lot of people who are not great B/S umpires because of a mechanical flaw or flaws, which lead to inconsistency. They may think they have a great zone and they think they are funamentally sound, but when they have the money pitch on the corner they miss it. Or when they have a big regular season game with two good batteries they hear the inconsistent word thrown all around them. Or on the tough pitches, they are not consistent.

Maybe those big dogs are in your corner, and want you to take the next step in your career. And they see something you need to think about doing to make your B/S better. Don't be so stubborn you don't at least listen to the older guys, and think about their advice. Ultimately it's your call, their advice might be bad. But doesn't hundred's or thousands of games under someone's belt give them some insight as to what might improve your work?

Or is it that every big dog in your association ar guys with 1 year of experience 20 times, instead of 20 years experience? Think about it.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by PWL

And you're good at putting words in people's mouths. Some one could have very well have signed in for him without his knowledge. I don't know who they sign in for nor do I even care. We have a board, but never get a report. It seems they pick certain people for certain things. I find it strange the same people who run together get playoff games together.

What I alluded to was if plate and field mechanics were a specific requirement, some people who work higher level games shouldn't be working them. I've seem some who are past their prime, if they ever had one to begin with.

Now, I think we have some very knowledgeable and competent officials. They just don't make themselves accessible. Like Dave said about fishing and cutting bait. They put themselves in the position that they should cut bait.

Way to hijack a thread..........

Hey, pal....you're the one to mention Dave's name in the same context of people cheating and things you couldn't mention. I asked if you accusing Dave. You could have just answered the question.

No one's hijacked anything. We've moved along to the policy Dave mentioned of your coaches selecting post season umps. Keep up.

In my area, playoff coaches can name three umps they would like to see on the dish or their home games, and three they want to scratch from any of their home games. The commissioner tries to accomodate the plate job requests (but, it is often the same few guys that EVERYBODY wants anyway!) and always honors the scratch list! I don't really have a problem with this, nor do most the umpires in my association I have talked to about it. You don't have to make anybodies "preferred" list to do playoffs, and you could still do an away game for a team who has scratched you! (don't get any funny ideas! Nobody ever knows if they have been scratched, and it should be that way!)