Malicious Contact Rule Help

[blindofficial]

Ok maybe I'm not reading this right, but I don't get part of this rule:

Malicious contact on offense pently:
"if on offense, the player is ejected and declared out, UNLESS he has already scored."

That is the part I don't. Why is he not ejected, even if he scored? Isn't the ball suppose to be dead at the moment of malicious contact and the player ejected?

Help!

[UmpJM]

blindofficial,

He IS ejected (when the play is over) - he's just not out.

Because he has already scored and the malicious contact does not nullify his run or "retroactively" make him out.

JM

[SAump]

He may be ejected, but he may not be declared out if he has already scored.

Here is an interesting video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1lHspk6IVM
Careful if video is not HS or NCAA game.
Notice how many members of the offense leave the dugout to converge behind the circle.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by blindofficial

Ok maybe I'm not reading this right, but I don't get part of this rule:

Malicious contact on offense pently:
"if on offense, the player is ejected and declared out, UNLESS he has already scored."

That is the part I don't. Why is he not ejected, even if he scored? Isn't the ball suppose to be dead at the moment of malicious contact and the player ejected?

Help!

The phase "unless he has already scored" refers to "and declared out", and not to "The player is ejected."

[blindofficial]

Originally Posted by CoachJM

blindofficial,

He IS ejected (when the play is over) - he's just not out.

Because he has already scored and the malicious contact does not nullify his run or "retroactively" make him out.

JM

So that being said, do you see alot of that? Meaning, I imagine one player would do this to score a run to "take one for the team." I guess I don't understand why the run would count if the player will be ejected for doing a "malicious act."

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by blindofficial

So that being said, do you see alot of that? Meaning, I imagine one player would do this to score a run to "take one for the team." I guess I don't understand why the run would count if the player will be ejected for doing a "malicious act."

Read it again, carefully. It says unless he has ALREADY scored. Scoring came before the malicious act, therefore the ejection is the appropriate penalty and the run scores. Why would you penalize a legal act that occured prior to the illegal act?

The kid is getting tossed for the crime he committed. What more do you think should happen?

[DonInKansas]

Easy breakdown:

I punch you in the face before scoring: I'm out and ejected.

I punch you in the face after scoring: I scored and I'm ejected.

[blindofficial]

Originally Posted by DonInKansas

Easy breakdown:

I punch you in the face before scoring: I'm out and ejected.

I punch you in the face after scoring: I scored and I'm ejected.

Got it! I looked into way too much. I was thinking a the runner was the same one that did the act AND having the score count when he scored. I was thinking the score counted when he crossed the plate, but afterwards got ejected.... Rookie mistake!

[greymule]

The phase "unless he has already scored" refers to "and declared out", and not to "The player is ejected."

100% correct. Therefore:

"if on offense, the player is ejected and, UNLESS he has already scored, declared out."

Originally Posted by greymule

[B]"if on offense, the player is ejected and, UNLESS he has already scored, declared out."

You would think all of those english majors at NFHS rules committee would have worded it that way eh?

[PeteBooth]

There is a caveat.

As the rule states, the run scores and then the player ejected. However, if there were a Force Play situation in effect and the Runner Scored Legally but malicously contact F2, the FPSR would be in effect and 2 would be declared out. There is FED case play on this as well.


It's no different, then R1 sliding safely into second base but illegally contacts F4/F6. We would record 2 on the play.

Therefore you need to take a look at the situation meaning "is the FPSR in effect" If there was no Force Play situation in effect and R3 scored Legally but then Maliciously Contacted F2, the run counts player ejecetd.

If the FPSR is in effect, and a Player Maliciously contacts a player (even if they already scored), we record 2 on the play.


Pete Booth

[NickG]

Not infrequently, malicious contact occurs in conjunction with obstruction. For example, the catcher is four or five feet up the line without the ball and the the runner collides with him barreling for home.

Now, according to this discussion, the runner is out/ejected and the run does not score. However, what about the obstruction on the part of the catcher? Why is the obstruction infraction not punished also?

Why, then, would it not be malicious contact, but awarded home on the obstruction, THEN ejected for the malicious contact?

[UmpJM]

NickG,

FED has decided that they really want to discourage malicious contact.

Hence, in the situation you describe, the malicious contact "trumps" the obstruction, and the obstruction is ignored - by rule.

JM

[bossman72]

Originally Posted by NickG

Why, then, would it not be malicious contact, but awarded home on the obstruction, THEN ejected for the malicious contact?

If i'm not mistaken, this is the NCAA interp.

FED, by rule, MC superscedes obstruction always.


ps- the new FED defensive MC rule is pretty darn stupid IMO

[DG]

Originally Posted by bossman72

If i'm not mistaken, this is the NCAA interp.

ps- the new FED defensive MC rule is pretty darn stupid IMO

That is correct for NCAA, runner would be awarded the base on obstruction and then ejected.

What's stupid about a defensive player creating MC and being ejected for it?