Dropped Third Strike

[umpduck11]

Originally Posted by John L

We were playing fall ball yesterday in the sunny and actually warm Midwest and this situation came up. Bases loaded, no outs. Catcher drops third strike, batter takes off to first. Catcher throws to first gets one out ball goes back to home runner is safe. Could we have played it as follows: catcher steps on home plate for forced out then throws to first to get second out. My question is did we have to play the batter first because of the dropped third strike? Can the batter advance with the bases loaded with a dropped third strike?

With less than two out, and first base occupied, the batter is out on
an uncaught third strike. You did not get an out at first base, as the BR
was already out, making that play unneccesary.
The batter can legally advance on an uncaught third strike, with the
bases loaded, only if there are two out.

[bluezebra]

Originally Posted by umpduck11

With less than two out, and first base occupied, the batter is out on
an uncaught third strike. You did not get an out at first base, as the BR
was already out, making that play unneccesary.
The batter can legally advance on an uncaught third strike, with the
bases loaded, only if there are two out.

To qualify this statement; a batter may advance on an uncaught third strike at ANY TIME, if 1B is unoccupied, or if there are two outs. If the bases are loaded with two outs, the catcher (F2) just needs to step on home plate while in possession of the ball.

Bob

[tibear]

The only time the batter can steal first with less than two outs is when there is no baserunner at first base at the time of the pitch.

[bluezebra]

Originally Posted by tibear

The only time the batter can steal first with less than two outs is when there is no baserunner at first base at the time of the pitch.

There is NO way a batter/runner can steal first base.

Bob

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by bluezebra

There is NO way a batter/runner can steal first base.

Bob

I'm sure he was using it as a figure of speech only. It raised my eyebrows when I first read it too.

[mbyron]

Yes I thought this expression odd, too. Turns out "stolen base" is defined in something known as "Rule 10.08," which I had never read before. Anyway, it seems a stolen base is not credited when a runner advances due to a passed ball, wild pitch, or error. I can't think of any other way for BR to reach 1B on this play, so it doesn't sound as if it would count as a steal.

None of this, however, is part of umpiring, so I could well be wrong.

[tibear]

Of course, the batter/runner is not stealing first in the strictest sense.

Around these parts the term "stealing first" is used interchangeably with "dropped third strike". It shouldn't be but it is.

[bluezebra]

Originally Posted by tibear

Of course, the batter/runner is not stealing first in the strictest sense.

Around these parts the term "stealing first" is used interchangeably with "dropped third strike". It shouldn't be but it is.

And "dropped third strike" is also wrong. It's a "third strike not caught". And, just because these statements have been used for years, doesn't make them correct.

Bob

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by bluezebra

And "dropped third strike" is also wrong. It's a "third strike not caught". And, just because these statements have been used for years, doesn't make them correct.

Bob

And the reason "dropped third strike" is wrong, is because it perpetuates the myth that it's okay for the catcher to catch the ball on a bounce, and consider that a "caught third strike." By saying "uncaught third strike" or "third strike not caught," you capture the true essense of what the rule implies, that the ball must be caught on the fly in those situations.

[LMan]

Originally Posted by bluezebra

And "dropped third strike" is also wrong. It's a "third strike not caught". And, just because these statements have been used for years, doesn't make them correct.

Bob

While you are absolutely correct, "good luck with that" on changing popular perception. This one will change right about the time a fair batted ball bounding over the LF/RF wall stops being a "ground rule double."