OBR Ambidexterous pitcher

[JJ]

I know from the OBR that if an ambidexterous pitcher faces a switch-hitter, the pitcher must declare with which hand he will pitch to that batter. My question is, can the batter then switch from one side to the other - and back again - during his at bat?

Here's the sitch - R1. The batter entered the box as a righty, and the pitcher switched the glove so he could throw as a righty. The umpire had the pitcher declare, and he declared "righty". The batter then switched to bad left-handed, ultimately to give R1 a better chance to steal with the left-handed batter doing his best to block the view of the catcher. The runner DID steal, and then the batter wanted to switch back to bat right-handed, which, as it turned out, was his natural side to hit from.

Input?

JJ

[UmpJM]

JJ,

This is a "point not covered" in the OBR rules. The PBUC says each may change "handedness" one time during any given batter's at bat.

In your sitch, the batter used his "switch" when he changed to be a left-handed batter. According to the PBUC, he's stuck being a left-handed batter until he completes his at bat.

JM

[Pete in AZ]

I don't know, I thought that we had a good discussion about this a while ago. Didn't we all agree that the rule allows a batter to switch boxes at whim as long as he doesn't do it when the pitcher is on the rubber and ready to pitch? I have never encountered this but I sure wouldn't have a problem calling the guy out for trying to mess with the pitcher. That is umpire's judgement.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Pete in AZ

I don't know, I thought that we had a good discussion about this a while ago. Didn't we all agree that the rule allows a batter to switch boxes at whim as long as he doesn't do it when the pitcher is on the rubber and ready to pitch?

Yes, if the pitcher is not ambidextrous. If the pitcher is ambidextrous, then it depends on the rules code being used.

I have never encountered this but I sure wouldn't have a problem calling the guy out for trying to mess with the pitcher. That is umpire's judgement.

It's umpire judgment, but it's not a position that's supported by rule. Batters sometimes request time out to "mess with the pitcher". I wouldn't call the batter out for that.

[Dave Hensley]

Originally Posted by SAump

I cannot follow the logic of the first sentence. Get some rest.

Note to others. Please ignore the first sentence from Bob.

This message will self-destruct (my delete button) in one hour.

Bob is responding to the previous poster's claim that a batter can switch batter's boxes more than once per at bat. Bob's answer is yes that's true, if the pitcher is not ambidextrous.

Without the context of the thread, I guess I can see where you might be confused by Bob's answer, but it's a discussion. It was an answer to a question, not a standalone statement. Context matters.

[jxt127]

6.06 (b) The batter is out if he steps from one box to the other while the pitcher is ready to pitch.


Actually had this happen last Thursday.

[Dave Hensley]

Originally Posted by jxt127

6.06 (b) The batter is out if he steps from one box to the other while the pitcher is ready to pitch.


Actually had this happen last Thursday.

The key phrase in your rule cite is "while the pitcher is ready to pitch." Until the pitcher assumes a legal pitching position, the batter is free to step into either batter's box and prepare to hit. Unless, that is, the pitcher happens to be ambidextrous, in which case different rules codes have different rulings for preventing an endless loop.

[jxt127]

Oh I agree Dave.

[Pete in AZ]

Bear with me guys, I was a lawyer and am a teacher so words have a particular significance to me. You are killing Peter for Paul's crimes. It makes no difference if the pitcher is ambidextrous or not. Once he has assumed his place on the rubber, if the batter switches boxes, he is out. The pitcher has restrictions on his actions as does the batter. The pitcher has legally engaged the pitching rubber and is ready to pitch (it says nothing about having to be set) when the batter changes boxes; OUT! JJ was speaking of OBR, so that is what we should be speaking to. I only see a dozen HS games a year and don't have that book here, does HS allow this? College and Pros don't, so what rule code are you referring to? Bob agreed that umpire judgement is involved, but this is pretty cut and dry. If the pitcher isn't on the rubber, the guy can switch on every pitch if he wants to.

[Dave Hensley]

Originally Posted by Pete in AZ

Bear with me guys, I was a lawyer and am a teacher so words have a particular significance to me. You are killing Peter for Paul's crimes. It makes no difference if the pitcher is ambidextrous or not. Once he has assumed his place on the rubber, if the batter switches boxes, he is out. The pitcher has restrictions on his actions as does the batter. The pitcher has legally engaged the pitching rubber and is ready to pitch (it says nothing about having to be set) when the batter changes boxes; OUT! JJ was speaking of OBR, so that is what we should be speaking to. I only see a dozen HS games a year and don't have that book here, does HS allow this? College and Pros don't, so what rule code are you referring to? Bob agreed that umpire judgement is involved, but this is pretty cut and dry. If the pitcher isn't on the rubber, the guy can switch on every pitch if he wants to.

Well, no offense Pete but the rules were written by and for gentlemen, not lawyers. "In position ready to pitch" can reasonably be interpreted to mean when the pitcher has assumed a legal pitching position - windup or set. Think of it this way - at any point in which the umpire would logically grant the batter a request for time, then the batter can do that and switch to the other box. He can do this repeatedly, UNLESS the pitcher switches handedness (which only happens when the pitcher is ambidextrous.)

The purpose of rule 6.06(b) is to keep the batter from disconcerting the pitcher or causing him to balk. It's very rarely encountered, and any umpire who's looking to call an out on a batter who wants to switch handedness is very likely dabbling in over-officiousness.

[SAump]

What rule allows the batter to switch boxes on a whim? If the batter switches boxes, then the pitcher if he so chooses may allow his defense to move to other positions. Time would be appropriate. If you grant the batter time to switch boxes repeatedly, then you are also granting the defense time to adjust their positioning.

Someone recognizes the importance of placing time limits on this endless loop. The pitcher must first declare. The switch hitter then makes a decision. He may switch during the course of an at-bat, but he may not switch after each and every pitch. If others allow the batter to switch after every pitch, then that will tell me what kind of game their having. Gentlemen, behave here.

Hope my partner never switches places after every pitch. NO. You can't do that. You stay where you are.

[Pete in AZ]

Originally Posted by SAump

What rule allows the batter to switch boxes on a whim? If the batter switches boxes, then the pitcher if he so chooses may allow his defense to move to other positions. Time would be appropriate. If you grant the batter time to switch boxes repeatedly, then you are also granting the defense time to adjust their positioning.

Someone recognizes the importance of placing time limits on this endless loop. The pitcher must first declare. The switch hitter then makes a decision. He may switch during the course of an at-bat, but he may not switch after each and every pitch. If others allow the batter to switch after every pitch, then that will tell me what kind of game their having. Gentlemen, behave here.

Then you would be wrong. The rule book clearly permits a batter to switch boxes as long as he doesn't do it while the pitcher is on the rubber and ready to pitch. We have had this discussion many times before. I don't like to participate in all the discussions but this one is pretty clear. As I said, I don't have any trouble calling the guy out if the pitcher complies with his restrictions. If the batter is doing this to rile the pitcher and his coach doesn't know the rule, I'm not there to do his job. If he comes out and asks me why I allow it, I may say that he can do it all he wants since his pitcher is not on the rubber and ready. Wanna bet that the defensive coach does his job and then I can do mine.

NO. You can't do that. You stay where you are.

That is the sign of an OOO. Then you'll have the offensive coach telling you that you don't know the rules very well. I apologize if that offends, but your interp is wrong.

[JJ]

After looking through the OBR, I find no rule that PROHIBITS a batter from switching between every pitch, if he so chooses - only the rule that says the ambidexterous pitcher must declare and remain if a switch-hitter steps to the plate and wants to switch.
I accept the PBUC note as backup for a ruling. Thanks.

JJ

[SAump]

Batter can't leave the box unless he asks for TIME and PU grants it.

d) The following experimental rule shall be in effect for all National Association Leagues in 2006:
(1) The batter shall keep at least one foot in the batter’s box throughout the batter’s time at bat, unless one of the following exceptions applies, in which case the batter may leave the batter’s box but not the dirt area surrounding home plate:
(i) The batter swings at a pitch;
(ii) The batter is forced out of the batter’s box by a pitch;
(iii) A member of either team requests and is granted “Time”;
(iv) A defensive player attempts a play on a runner at any base;
(v) The batter feints a bunt;
(vi) A wild pitch or passed ball occurs;
(vii) The pitcher leaves the dirt area of the pitching mound after receiving the ball; or
(viii) The catcher leaves the catcher’s box to give defensive signals.
Notwithstanding Rule 6.02(c), if the batter intentionally leaves the batter’s box and delays play, and none of the exceptions listed in Rule 6.02(d)(1)(i) through (viii) applies, the umpire shall award a strike without the pitcher having to deliver the pitch. The ball shall remain alive.

edited to add emphasis

[cbfoulds]

Originally Posted by SAump

Batter can't leave the box unless he asks for TIME and PU grants it.

d) The following experimental rule shall be in effect for all National Association Leagues in 2006:
(1) The batter shall keep at least one foot in the batter’s box throughout the batter’s time at bat, unless one of the following exceptions applies, in which case the batter may leave the batter’s box but not the dirt area surrounding home plate:
(i) The batter swings at a pitch;
(ii) The batter is forced out of the batter’s box by a pitch;
(iii) A member of either team requests and is granted “Time”;
(iv) A defensive player attempts a play on a runner at any base;
(v) The batter feints a bunt;
(vi) A wild pitch or passed ball occurs;
(vii) The pitcher leaves the dirt area of the pitching mound after receiving the ball; or
(viii) The catcher leaves the catcher’s box to give defensive signals.
Notwithstanding Rule 6.02(c), if the batter intentionally leaves the batter’s box and delays play, and none of the exceptions listed in Rule 6.02(d)(1)(i) through (viii) applies, the umpire shall award a strike without the pitcher having to deliver the pitch. The ball shall remain alive.

Did you READ the rule you posted?!?
There are SEVEN EXCEPTIONS, and the penalty applies ONLY if B leaves the box AND DELAYS PLAY, in which case he is charged a strike.

Originally Posted by SAump

Batter can't leave the box unless he asks for TIME and PU grants it.

I'm calling BS on that one.