Infield Fly???

[mrm21711]

Runners on first & second, one out. Batter hits what I would call a "flare" (about 15-20 feet off the ground). Shortstop jogs a few steps to his left and catches it, doubles the runner off second who was running on the pitch. Based on what I described (I know its judgment and you gotta see it to be sure), do you have infield fly or not?

[LakeErieUmp]

mrm - are you wondering what would have happened if the play had been different and SS had dropped the ball? in that case I might want to "be there" to determine if it's a fly or a line drive. But in what you described it doesn't matter if it's Infield Fly Rule or not

[mrm21711]

Originally Posted by LakeErieUmp

mrm - are you wondering what would have happened if the play had been different and SS had dropped the ball? in that case I might want to "be there" to determine if it's a fly or a line drive. But in what you described it doesn't matter if it's Infield Fly Rule or not

No, my partner and myself had a "discussion" about whether or not this is an infield fly situation. He didnt feel it was because:

1) He didnt judge it to be ordinary effort. His criteria were: the ball wasnt high enough, there wasnt enough "trajectory" on the ball.
2) It was called an Infield Fly as the ball was coming down.
3) He felt that the infielder had the ability to intentionally drop this ball, and would have enforced this rule had he dropped it intentionally. I dont see how this rule could be enforced but it isnt an Infield Fly situation. Obviously the intentionally dropped fly ball rule isnt in effect in an IF situation.

In my opinion, this ball did not fit the definition of line drive as "sharp and direct from the bat to the fielder." Thoughts please????[/

[LakeErieUmp]

Not being there of course I can't tell but I see your side. But did your partner REALLY say that intentional dropping is the key??? Sounds like he might have gone infield fly on a sharp line drive!

[Rcichon]

IMO: Fielder must have enuff hang time to park himself in one spot or maybe waver there for a short time before IFF. If he drops intentionally, I agree w/TussAgee11; call IFF late anyway.

[mattmets]

According to the MLBUM (not sure about other books), the IFF is supposed to be called as the ball is on its way down anyway. Calling a late IFF here doesn't seem like a bad idea.

[TussAgee11]

Originally Posted by Rcichon

IMO: Fielder must have enuff hang time to park himself in one spot or maybe waver there for a short time before IFF. If he drops intentionally, I agree w/TussAgee11; call IFF late anyway.

By rule, an intentionally dropped line drive with any force at any base results in an immediate deadball and the BR is out, and runners return. In all codes. Intentionally dropped is qualified as a fielder batting the ball down.

[TussAgee11]

Flares are not IFF in my opinion, but remember if they let it fall, I may be inclined to give a very late IFF.

If they intentionally drop it, kill it immediatly, BR out, runners back to bases at TOP.

[Chukinrox]

It is an infield fly if the fielder could make the catch with ordinary effort. If the umpire judged the ball to be a fly ball that could be caught with ordinary effort then it is an infield fly. If more than ordinary effort was needed or if it was not a fly ball then there is no infield fly

[TussAgee11]

Originally Posted by Chukinrox

It is an infield fly if the fielder could make the catch with ordinary effort. If the umpire judged the ball to be a fly ball that could be caught with ordinary effort then it is an infield fly. If more than ordinary effort was needed or if it was not a fly ball then there is no infield fly

What we are hung up on here is not ordinary effort, but line drive, and spirit of the rule. I say if the defense has the opportunity to take advantage of what the rule is trying to prevent, then call it.

[mrm21711]

Originally Posted by TussAgee11

What we are hung up on here is not ordinary effort, but line drive, and spirit of the rule. I say if the defense has the opportunity to take advantage of what the rule is trying to prevent, then call it.

The definition of line drive is a ball hit that goes sharp and direct from the bat to the fielder without touching the ground. I dont see how you can call a flare 15-20 feet off the ground a line drive based on that definition.

[TussAgee11]

Originally Posted by mrm21711

The definition of line drive is a ball hit that goes sharp and direct from the bat to the fielder without touching the ground. I dont see how you can call a flare 15-20 feet off the ground a line drive based on that definition.

Who said I did? Oh, wait, I did very early in this thread! Flares to me are those soft line drives. If the ball is 15 feet in the air, all thats left to see is if the fielder has ordinary effort and its a fair ball...

[Chukinrox]

Listen... If, in YOUR JUDGMENT, you could call the hit a fly ball, and the fielder could make a catch with ordinary effort, in fair territory, it is an infield fly.

[DG]

Originally Posted by TussAgee11

What we are hung up on here is not ordinary effort, but line drive, and spirit of the rule. I say if the defense has the opportunity to take advantage of what the rule is trying to prevent, then call it.

A basketball goal is 10 feet above the ground and many shortstops are going to go up that high to catch a flare. Or a flare that was 15 feet above the ground is 10 feet when it reaches the SS. These are not fly balls for IFF purposes. The defense should catch it and the offense should be wary of advancing until the ball is not caught.