Full-count

[Whowefoolin]

Usually with the count "full", I will hold up the hands indicating the number of balls (three fingers on left hand) and the number of strikes (two fingers on right hand) and then say..."Full Count!"

But I was corrected tonight by a fan (could have been an off duty ump) that challenged me to find where the word "full count" is the rule book.

Anyone know? Icouldn't find it.

Max

[BenGilli]

Im not sure where or if that is in the rule book.. but "full count" is definately something that people will recognize.. and understand what you are talking about.. When I have a full count i show the count say 3 balls 2 strikes.. full count.. i dont think you should be overly worried about what this fan brought to your attention

[rex]

What Ben said is true BUT the proper way is three balls and two strikes. Just as the proper way a announing two outs is to say. "The outs are two"

Then again fans and broadcast announcers don't know the difference.

rex

[badbamaump]

I was taught not to say "full count", just announce "3balls/2 strikes".....the reasoning being that "full count", could be misconstrued. Just the way I do it...

Will

[Tim C]

Have always been taught (and passed on in training) that you hold both hands up with fingers extended and say, "3/2 or 3 balls, two strikes!" We NEVER use the term "full count."

As to outs, I have never heard anyone say "the outs are TWO!"

But what do I know I am not Rut.

[GeeBee]

I was taught by veteran softball umpire that when a full count exists, close both hands to form a fist, hold them at face level, and announce, "Full count!!" This technique
alleviates the mis-reading of fingers held aloft.

[llblue]

The term "full count" is simply baseball lexicon, nothing more.

Holding up two closed fists is "nothing" that's a whole lot different from 3 balls, 2.

[DrC.]

I have to agree with GeeBee. Although it is not the "TAUGHT" way of doing it, using either 1 or 2 fist up high
will be appreciated more by an outfielder than 3 fingers on the left and 2 on the right. If you were an outfielder in a night game, do you really think he can distinguish each individual finger. No he can not. A fist can not be mis-understood. I don't think it could be miscontrued as no count since the batter has been up for at least 5 pitches already.
-- Only my 2 cents worth --

[JRutledge]

That is why you must not be a very good umpire, you do not believe in what you are taught or what you read?

But on that note, I was always taught to show 3 fingers for balls (left hand), and two fingers (right hand) for strikes. You see many umpires use two fists and say "full count" all the time. But according to what I have read (sorry, but it is something that I do a lot of) and been taught, you want to avoid using words or phrases that are not in the book. Reason behind this is that you cause confusion with the rules and definitions. You know like people think there is a "slide rule." But that is another discussion all together.

Peace

Originally posted by Tim C
Have always been taught (and passed on in training) that you hold both hands up with fingers extended and say, "3/2 or 3 balls, two strikes!" We NEVER use the term "full count."

As to outs, I have never heard anyone say "the outs are TWO!"

But what do I know I am not Rut.

[Edited by JRutledge on Apr 25th, 2001 at 01:33 PM]

[Tim C]

that there are several differences between softball mechanics and baseball mechanics.

I have been to pro school twice, have attended clinics run by MLB umpires and D1 umpires and they have all said exactly what Rut says concerning ball/strike signals:

Never, never, used closed fist unless it is to show "zero".

Now the rest of Rut's mindless attack can be left to the birds.

[badbamaump]

The latest signalling thingy that we're being taught down herebouts is to NOT SIGNAL Zero....you got 2 strikes, then you only got the right hand up with 2 fingers up (and not the "hook em horns" signal either). I dunno if you'd be allowed to do that wherever you work, but that's that way I'm being told to work.

Just my lil ole 2 CSA cents worth.

Will

[Tim C]

so right, Will. I just read my post and it did read WRONG.

As we have all been taught by Golden State, Evans, PAC-10 (9). YOU NEVER signal a zero in a count.

What I was thinking when I first posted was . . .

New hitter and some coach says, "hey what's the count?"

I then go fist to fist and say, "It is a new hitter, Bubba!"

My bad.

[badbamaump]

both of us have problems reading....lol

Course, what do either of us know??? sheesh better go back and look at THE BOOK.

Will

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by Tim C
that there are several differences between softball mechanics and baseball mechanics.

I have been to pro school twice, have attended clinics run by MLB umpires and D1 umpires and they have all said exactly what Rut says concerning ball/strike signals:

Never, never, used closed fist unless it is to show "zero".

Now the rest of Rut's mindless attack can be left to the birds.

You are the one that dragged my name into this discussion. Do not get upset now that I responded to your "cheap shot." You just cannot get over the fact that I have an opinion and can think for myself. I am glad you agree with me on this, but I am sure we will disagree some more. My opinions are not personal affronts to you, they are just my opinions of things I have learned, been taught, or read in my own time.

Tim relax, that is why it is a discussion board.

Peace

[dani]

A closed fist should equate to zero balls or strikes. Half the time the pitcher can't see the fingers the catcher is putting down, so lets not worry about the in/outfielders.

Two closed fists raised should be reserved for situations where there are 0 balls and 0 strikes on the batter. An example would be the signal given after a pickoff move(s) prior to the first pitch being delivered to the plate, etc. The signal for three balls and two strikes should be three fingers raised on the left hand and two fingers on the right.