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Old Sat Jun 25, 2005, 02:55pm
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In a junior game (17-20) close game 1 -0 in the 7th inning, I'm BU, r3 only 1 out, hit to second, he throws home and had runner by a couple of steps, Runner slides, huge cloud of dust in PU eyes, but the catcher dropped the ball. Partner has great timming, but doesn't ask to see the ball, and calls out. The offended team goes nuts, coach comes down to argue and asks my partner to seek help. He chooses to. (P.S. made the score 2-0 not 1-1 not that it effected anything)

He comes to me and says did you see the drop, I say do you want me to answer, he says yes, so I tell him. I then said it's your call, we're going to get S%%% either way, but I vote we make it right, he says yup me too, and changes his call, brief arguement from the newly offended team, to which my partner simply says, "I had to make it right" No more problems, and it was not brought up the rest of the game.

We have often been told never change a call, you'll hear b%$$$$ing for the rest of the game, Check this call, check that call. What is your opinion on A) my partners choice, B) my answer, C) changing any call ever, and D) has changing a call ever resulted in a deteriorated game?

Personally, I am glad we changed the call, we made the right choice in this instant. I think we would have had way more problems were we to have left the call as is.
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old Sat Jun 25, 2005, 03:39pm
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Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 236
Just me .......

As PU : A) Did I miss something ?
B) Was my partner in a position to help me ?

If I think I missed it and I think my partner can help me, I'll go to him and ask what he saw. If I think I got the call right or my partner wasn't in a position to see the play, I'm not granting the appeal.

As BU : I generally don't say anything unless my partner comes to me on appeal.


EDIT: Beaching doesn't bother me, that what ejections are for !!!
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old Sat Jun 25, 2005, 03:58pm
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Posts: 180
Thumbs up

When you make such an obvious bad call, you have to change it. Failure to change it will cause you to lose all crediblity for not only the game in question, but also for future games. It will take a year or more for the offended team to forget your mistake. They may not take it on you but they will make sure to tell all the other umpires about it. That won't do you any good, especially if you have hopes for advancement. The pros change calls so we can do the same thing.

Here's a way to make it go down better. Before you announce the change, walk over to the coach of the team that you are about to screw and explain that you made a mistake and are going to correct it. Only after you have had a 15-30 second conversation with him and given him an opportunity to have his say, should you announce the change. He'll appreciate that you brought him into the process and he might surprise you by agreeing with your change.

OTOH, if he starts to get hot, here are two questions that you can ask him. "Coach, what did you see?" He either has to lie or change the subject. Second you can say "How would you want to be treated if the situation were reversed?" Again, he either has to lie or change the subject. Either way, you have gained the upper hand if an ejection is in the offing. FWIW, I've never had a coach go ballistic when I brought him into the process before announcing a change. It has an enormous calming effect.
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Old Sat Jun 25, 2005, 04:15pm
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Posts: 555
You can't let an obviously wrong call like the one you are describing, go. If it can be legitimately corrected because another umpire saw and obvious loose ball, change the call.

I had a very similar play happen at second. Ball clearly beats runner, tag down, cloud of dust... wait, call runner out, then see ball rolling towards left field. And trust me, it feels even worse to have to change that call when you are the only umpire.

As someone on this board once said, "Coach, are you mad I changed the call or that I got it right?"

[Edited by Kaliix on Jun 26th, 2005 at 09:23 PM]
Well I am certainly wiser than this man. It is only too likely that neither of us has any knowledge to boast of; but he thinks that he knows something which he does not know, whereas I am quite conscious of my ignorance. At any rate it seems that I am wiser than he is to this small extent, that I do not think that I know what I do not know. ~Socrates
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old Sat Jun 25, 2005, 09:59pm
DG DG is offline
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A) Your partner made the right choice to ask for help.
B) You should answer the question, "he dropped the ball, no doubt about it", not ask him if he wants you to answer the question he just asked.
C) Some calls beg to be changed, some don't.
D) Of rourse changing a call can lead to a deteriorated game, but if the change was the right call, so be it.
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