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Old Thu Oct 21, 2004, 08:54pm
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I understand that there were some controversial calls in the 7 game playoff series between NY and Red Sox. Would someone like to go over all the controversial calls and explain what you would have called if you were officiating.

One play that I saw was a check swing. The batter turned his whole body around but he didn't appear to have swung the bat. Umpire at third said no swing however everyone else from their reaction seemed to have felt it was a swin.

Thanks,

Greg
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Old Fri Oct 22, 2004, 07:58am
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Originally posted by Gre144

I understand that there were some controversial calls in the 7 game playoff series between NY and Red Sox. Would someone like to go over all the controversial calls and explain what you would have called if you were officiating.

One play that I saw was a check swing. The batter turned his whole body around but he didn't appear to have swung the bat. Umpire at third said no swing however everyone else from their reaction seemed to have felt it was a swin.

Thanks,


Greg, the Calls were not controversal in fact they were no brainer calls. The discussions have centered around Umpires huddling ala Football officials and changing calls.

There is a contrast in the way the game is umpired compared to say 10 to 15 yrs. ago where the emphasis is on getting the calls right and forget about your ego.

We at least I am not used to seeing Umpires huddling (except to discuss a rule interp) and changing calls.

Don't know if this would have had an impact, but let's take the Reggie Jackson play of yrs. past. If the game was umpired using today's philosophy perhaps (Obviously, We will never know), that call might have changed.

Same on the infamous play at first base in the KC / Cards series yrs. back.

Therefore, in a nutshell (just read through the various threads), the discussions have centered around a change in umpire protocol not about Controversial calls.

Pete Booth
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Old Fri Oct 22, 2004, 08:22am
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Well...

Quote:
Originally posted by PeteBooth
Originally posted by Gre144

I understand that there were some controversial calls in the 7 game playoff series between NY and Red Sox. Would someone like to go over all the controversial calls and explain what you would have called if you were officiating.

One play that I saw was a check swing. The batter turned his whole body around but he didn't appear to have swung the bat. Umpire at third said no swing however everyone else from their reaction seemed to have felt it was a swin.

Thanks,


Greg, the Calls were not controversal in fact they were no brainer calls. The discussions have centered around Umpires huddling ala Football officials and changing calls.

There is a contrast in the way the game is umpired compared to say 10 to 15 yrs. ago where the emphasis is on getting the calls right and forget about your ego.

We at least I am not used to seeing Umpires huddling (except to discuss a rule interp) and changing calls.

Don't know if this would have had an impact, but let's take the Reggie Jackson play of yrs. past. If the game was umpired using today's philosophy perhaps (Obviously, We will never know), that call might have changed.

Same on the infamous play at first base in the KC / Cards series yrs. back.

Therefore, in a nutshell (just read through the various threads), the discussions have centered around a change in umpire protocol not about Controversial calls.

Pete Booth
Well Pete don't know about the KC/Cards. That was a pure judgement call, not even going to think about changing.

Just like the call last night at 1B. The umpire saw the ball was way ahead of the runner, the runner was guilty of horrible baserunning so he's out.

Even if TV wanted to beg for a safe.

If F3 would have applied the tag like he should quickly and at the bag it wouldn't have even been questionable, but since F3 did a bad job of selling the call it made it look a lot closer.

But I see your point.

Thanks
David
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Old Fri Oct 22, 2004, 09:36am
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Quote:
Originally posted by Gre144
I understand that there were some controversial calls in the 7 game playoff series between NY and Red Sox. Would someone like to go over all the controversial calls and explain what you would have called if you were officiating.

One play that I saw was a check swing. The batter turned his whole body around but he didn't appear to have swung the bat. Umpire at third said no swing however everyone else from their reaction seemed to have felt it was a swin.

Thanks,

Greg
And that is the major problem with most sports now days, "EVERYONE ELSE" , are NOT officiating the game. Its like the media and journalism in this country now. They all have an opinion that they feel others NEED to know about. And we know completely about opinions.

I do know one thing for sure, it was not a swing because the umpire doing the job said so. Or maybe your recommending a conference for check swings now. How about the fans voting on every call and the result displayed on the board. Then look at the money saved for the officials. Talk about REALITY BASEBALL.

When Human Beings no longer do anything, there will be no more errors. Perfection will prevail.
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Old Sat Oct 23, 2004, 12:18am
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Well I am not sure if my question was answered so let's just look at the play that I saw. The batter swung his whole body around but the bat remained relatively in its pre swing position. Is this a check swing and thus a strike?

Greg
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Old Sat Oct 23, 2004, 07:16am
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This was discussed in an earlier thread. You likely won't get a definitive answer because it is a judgement call on the umpires part.

My opinion is that it is a swing and a strike. A player my have been able to keep the bat back but if to do so they have to twist their whole body around then they intended to swing.

Your mileage may vary...
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Old Sat Oct 23, 2004, 08:44am
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Did he swing at the ball?

Quote:
Originally posted by Gre144
Well I am not sure if my question was answered so let's just look at the play that I saw. The batter swung his whole body around but the bat remained relatively in its pre swing position. Is this a check swing and thus a strike?

Greg
Greg, bottom line is in the umpires judgement did he try to hit the ball, did he swing at the ball.

There is nothing in the book about a pre-swing position.

We've all seen guys hit the ball with the bat still on their shoulder.

I don't get into all the stuff about "did he break his wrist etc.,". If a coach asks, I tell him,"coach he swung at the ball" or "coach he didn't swing at the ball."

Thanks
DAvid
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