What The F*ck Ump?

[PAT THE REF]

Hey everyone, Bear with me - This is a long post; but an interesting one~!

For those of you that dont know me my name is Patrick & I am a head umpire of a local recreational league. I recently was the BU for a 15-16y.o game. There were three ejections and 2 suspensions, would you have done anything differently?

Here was the story:
Team A was in the lead by 4 runs. Team B was up too bat. Top of the 5th. (We play 6 innings) Two out - no one on. Team B's batter hits the ball but only lets it go about 15 feet. The pitcher picks up the ball. The batter starts walking down the 1st base line. The pitcher walks down towards 1st base. The pitcher starts skipping (literally). The batter then runs like anything to 1st base. The 1st baseman was standing on the base waiting for the pitcher to throw the ball. The pitcher thinks he can out run the batter so he runs. The batter is at least 1-2 steps safe. Then the pitchers foot hits the base. I call & sell the safe signal. (Now the "fun" begins).

The parents start off in the stands..... "You have to be kidding me! etc.... So I made the call and went to position B. Then I hear the Shortstop say - "Dont worry about it he sucks any way" Then the pitcher turns around and says "Yeah he can't even make a F---ing call at first~ The F---ing blind.... Boom. He's Gone.

As I throw there all star pitcher out of the game... My PU throws the Shortstop out (I cant honestly say what they said but he did tell me later that he was making hand movements and also cursing).

As they left the field they were cursing again & again. They decided to sit in the stands. Cursing (F-word etc..) theirs mouths off so I walk over to the coach (by the way I am the UIC) and tell the coach that they need to leave the field or they would forefit... So the coach called their parents and made them leave.

Two down 1 to go........

Then with the score tied at 7-7. Bases loaded - 2 outs.... Team A was at bat (Visitors). A player hits a long long long (almost over the fence) fly ball my PU strattles the 1st baseline and calls it fair. I thought it was fair too and he didn't call fair. So he turns and looks at me. I point towards centerfield. As I do, he does too indicating a fair ball. - Home run - they win 11-7.

The coach comes out after the long ball call and starts throwing his bats on the field. Enough said - ejection.....

Another day at the ball park......
Questions? Comments? Tips?

Thanks.......

[DG]

I think I might have gotten the SS first, which might have prevented the pitcher from running his mouth. Also, I don't understand the part about "almost over the fence", followed by a home run call, which I don't quite understand. Typical day at the ball park.

[Edited by DG on Jun 6th, 2004 at 10:15 PM]

[mrm21711]

I agree Pat, although I am not clear on the "almost over the fence" being called a home run? I think you made a typo or proofreading mistake. As far as how you handled the situation, I would give you an A. I believe firmly in stopping a situation as soon as possible, so I might have been more agressive in the situation, but think you handled it well. I would have told the coach, if I hear another word the game is over, thats terrible to be a part of. Good job. Your league director must handle this situation swiftly and enforce serious punishments, I think, to the coach and the players...maybe suspensions for the entire year.

[LDUB]

I had quite a crazy day today. 13 year old tournament. Called 4 games. First two games were by myself. They were semifinal games of the tournament. Ok, so first game, A vs. B. So game starts off good. We have the plate confrence. We have to flip to see who is the home team, but no one has a coin. So I say, I'll flip my plate brush. Put my thumb under it, flip it up into the air. Not the best flip on my part. The brush never turns over even once. We decided to reflip, and the game started.

Coaches from A & B are both relentless about every single call. They even yell at me for calls that go their way. I call a batter from team B out on strikes. Manager of A yells to me "Thats not a strike, but we'll take it." Of course the pitch was a curve ball right down the middle, the catcher didn't even have to move his glove. So game goes on, A ends up blowing the game big time. They loose by 1 in the bottom of the 7th. So I give team B their game ball back, tell the manager good game, and I wish him good luck on his game in the finals. Go over to manager A. Give him the ball. Tell him good game and good luck in the third place game. While I said that I was reaching out to shake his hand. Then he says I'll shake your hand but I won't say good game, you were horrible, and you should go back to strike zone school. I just walk away. Little did he know that I was going to be calling the plate at his next game.

Next game C vs. D. Team C was very polite. The coaches and the players. Never once argued a call. Team D, their manager was on me about a few close plays at third. He would question my calls a lot, but not with the intensity that manager A had. Game ends, team C wins.

I walk back to the parking lot, and meet up with my partner, who had just gotten there. The last two games were two man. A few of the parents from team C tell me good game, and to not listen to manager D, because he always yells a lot in every game he coaces.

Next game the losers play for third place. D vs. A. Manager D comes up to me before the game, he had heard about what the parents said to me in the parking lot, I told him that I would not hold a grudge against him for arguing with me last game. He was fine the whole game.

Game is going along OK. Team D is at bat, R3 & R2. Ground ball to third. F2 steps foreward to about 6 inches off the plate up the third base line. F5 checks R3 and throws to first. BR is out. R3 is coming home on the play. Throw to the plate. R3 goes in standing up, but he had to tippy toe around the catcher. I go safe, obsturction ( I know that is not the prefered way to signal obstrucion, but that is how I did it.) All of a sudden, one of the coaches is up by me asking for an explanation, so I am explaining myself, I see my partner ejection someone out of the dugout. One of the coaches had said the call was bull$hit, I didn't hear it but my partner did.

Game ends. A loses by 11 or 12. I go to give the balls back to manager A, I toss him the ball, and say nice game, and stick out my hand to shake his. He refuses to shake my hand, he tells me about how bad a game I called, so I start to walk away, then he tells me about how bad a game my partner called, then he says that I know that both of us are terrible. I thought I had called a good game, I don't know where he was coming from. An assistant coach from both teams had come up to me durring the game and complimented me on my strike zone.

Next game B vs. C for the championship. I'm in the field, finally after 3 games at the plate. Third or fourth inning. Team B up to bat. R3, two out. I'm in C. Pickoff throw at third, R3 dives back, I bang him out. Of course manager B had a great view of the play from the first base dugout, so he asks me where the tag was. Inning and a half later. Team C up to bat. R1 & R3. I'm in B. Batter hits to outfield gap. R3 scores. I watch R1 touch second, and the BR touch first. Third base coach is waving R3 home, I watch him touch third running at full speed, then I swing my head back to see the cutoff man catch the ball in the outfield, just as the BR touches second. BR takes a step off second, and cutoff man fires to third. I'm thinking BR ain't going to third, why throw there? So I follow the ball, and I see F5 catch it. Just as F5 catches the ball (it was a head high throw), I see R1 diving back to third. He must have turned around after I saw him touch third. Another bang bang play. I call him safe. The play had caught me off guard, but I still managed to make the right call. Manager C runs out of dugout and goes up to plate umpire, he argues with him about my call, about 5 seconds later, he gets ejected. Game goes fine after that.

Well, I really don't know what the point of this post is. I have forgotten what I was replying to. Well it's been a long day. I better get to sleep soon.

[His High Holiness]

Originally posted by LDUB
So I give team B their game ball back, tell the manager good game, and I wish him good luck on his game in the finals. Go over to manager A. Give him the ball. Tell him good game and good luck in the third place game. While I said that I was reaching out to shake his hand. Then he says I'll shake your hand but I won't say good game, you were horrible, and you should go back to strike zone school. I just walk away.

I walk back to the parking lot, and meet up with my partner, who had just gotten there. The last two games were two man. A few of the parents from team C tell me good game, and to not listen to manager D, because he always yells a lot in every game he coaces.

Next game the losers play for third place. D vs. A. Manager D comes up to me before the game, he had heard about what the parents said to me in the parking lot, I told him that I would not hold a grudge against him for arguing with me last game. He was fine the whole game.

All of a sudden, one of the coaches is up by me asking for an explanation, so I am explaining myself, I see my partner ejection someone out of the dugout. One of the coaches had said the call was bull$hit, I didn't hear it but my partner did.

I go to give the balls back to manager A, I toss him the ball, and say nice game, and stick out my hand to shake his. He refuses to shake my hand, he tells me about how bad a game I called, so I start to walk away, then he tells me about how bad a game my partner called, then he says that I know that both of us are terrible. I thought I had called a good game, I don't know where he was coming from. An assistant coach from both teams had come up to me durring the game and complimented me on my strike zone.

First, I cannot imagine umpiring under the circumstances described in this thread. These situations would never occur in the games that I do because I would have so many ejections that there would not be enough players left to play. But let's move onto specifics of LDUB's tourney.

LDUB;

It says under your name that you have 250 posts on this board. Hopefully that means that you have read thousands of other people's posts. Somewhere in those thousands of posts you should have read that you never shake hands with anybody after the game. Drop the baseballs and get the h$ll out of there - fast!

What the f$$$ are you doing listening to anybody but your partner after a game? Why are you shaking hands with coaches? Why are you parked in a place where fans can come talk to you? Why are you even listening to them? Have you learned nothing from your readings here at this forum?

Furthermore, what in the h$ll do you expect a coach to say to you after he has lost? Don't you know that most coaches consider it the umpire's fault after a loss? If you need validation and adoration from coaches, you need to find a new line of work. Even when they compliment you, they are only setting you up for the next game. If you believe a word they say then you are a green rookie.

You created most of your own problems in this fiasco. Furthermore, you failed to deal with those problems that did come up.

Suggestion: Read more and post less. You are obviously too incompetent to contribute intelligently.

Peter

[Kaliix]

I don't think Pat meant that he or the PU gave a homerun signal. I think he was saying that the ball was signaled fair and that because it was a long fly, it ENDED UP BEING A HOMERUN when all was said and done.

[jicecone]

PAT THE REF:

I agree there is no room for that language on the field, especially 15 yr olds but, I am not there to be their father either. The conversation was not between you and the players and so unless it was loud enough for the fans to hear, I would have put my "rabbits ears" away.

LDUB:

For what reason do you feel that you have to shake the coaches hand? This only creates an oppurtunity for him to make a comment. Walk off the field when the game is done.

If you don't think that your gonna like what a person has to say you, don't approach them to begin with. Then once you do, if they say the wrong thing you asked for it and you really have no right to eject them. Thats baiting the person. So just stay away.

[JRutledge]

LDUB,

Throw the balls to their dugouts or bench area, and get out of dodge. Very rarely do you even want to have words with a coach after a game. And if you know they were giving you crap or unhappy with your calls most of the game, say nothing. Silence cannot be quoted and no one can say you provoked a response.

And do not feel bad about what happened, we all make mistakes as we move thru the ranks. Despite what Peter thinks, I would not expect you to learn what those procedures are on this site. In my opinion, that is stuff you learn with your local associations or clinics. At least there you can learn the specific points and the specific procedures, then have people here just disagree with each other and no one figuring out what is right to wrong.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally posted by LDUB
Coaches from A & B are both relentless about every single call. They even yell at me for calls that go their way. I call a batter from team B out on strikes. Manager of A yells to me "Thats not a strike, but we'll take it." Of course the pitch was a curve ball right down the middle, the catcher didn't even have to move his glove. So game goes on, A ends up blowing the game big time. They loose by 1 in the bottom of the 7th. So I give team B their game ball back, tell the manager good game, and I wish him good luck on his game in the finals. Go over to manager A. Give him the ball. Tell him good game and good luck in the third place game. While I said that I was reaching out to shake his hand. Then he says I'll shake your hand but I won't say good game, you were horrible, and you should go back to strike zone school. I just walk away. Little did he know that I was going to be calling the plate at his next game.

Next game C vs. D. Team C was very polite. The coaches and the players. Never once argued a call. Team D, their manager was on me about a few close plays at third. He would question my calls a lot, but not with the intensity that manager A had. Game ends, team C wins.

I walk back to the parking lot, and meet up with my partner, who had just gotten there. The last two games were two man. A few of the parents from team C tell me good game, and to not listen to manager D, because he always yells a lot in every game he coaces.

Next game the losers play for third place. D vs. A. Manager D comes up to me before the game, he had heard about what the parents said to me in the parking lot, I told him that I would not hold a grudge against him for arguing with me last game. He was fine the whole game.

Game is going along OK. Team D is at bat, R3 & R2. Ground ball to third. F2 steps foreward to about 6 inches off the plate up the third base line. F5 checks R3 and throws to first. BR is out. R3 is coming home on the play. Throw to the plate. R3 goes in standing up, but he had to tippy toe around the catcher. I go safe, obsturction ( I know that is not the prefered way to signal obstrucion, but that is how I did it.) All of a sudden, one of the coaches is up by me asking for an explanation, so I am explaining myself, I see my partner ejection someone out of the dugout. One of the coaches had said the call was bull$hit, I didn't hear it but my partner did.

Game ends. A loses by 11 or 12. I go to give the balls back to manager A, I toss him the ball, and say nice game, and stick out my hand to shake his. He refuses to shake my hand, he tells me about how bad a game I called, so I start to walk away, then he tells me about how bad a game my partner called, then he says that I know that both of us are terrible. I thought I had called a good game, I don't know where he was coming from. An assistant coach from both teams had come up to me durring the game and complimented me on my strike zone.

Next game B vs. C for the championship. I'm in the field, finally after 3 games at the plate. Third or fourth inning. Team B up to bat. R3, two out. I'm in C. Pickoff throw at third, R3 dives back, I bang him out. Of course manager B had a great view of the play from the first base dugout, so he asks me where the tag was. Inning and a half later. Team C up to bat. R1 & R3. I'm in B. Batter hits to outfield gap. R3 scores. I watch R1 touch second, and the BR touch first. Third base coach is waving R3 home, I watch him touch third running at full speed, then I swing my head back to see the cutoff man catch the ball in the outfield, just as the BR touches second. BR takes a step off second, and cutoff man fires to third. I'm thinking BR ain't going to third, why throw there? So I follow the ball, and I see F5 catch it. Just as F5 catches the ball (it was a head high throw), I see R1 diving back to third. He must have turned around after I saw him touch third. Another bang bang play. I call him safe. The play had caught me off guard, but I still managed to make the right call. Manager C runs out of dugout and goes up to plate umpire, he argues with him about my call, about 5 seconds later, he gets ejected. Game goes fine after that.

Well, I really don't know what the point of this post is. I have forgotten what I was replying to. Well it's been a long day. I better get to sleep soon.

There isn't enough cheese to feed the rats you had.

You need to squelch the bad behavior with some ejections. Don't take this kind of crap when working alone.

I would've confronted the coach who said "that wasn't a strike but we'll take it." That guy needed to go, as did all of them.

I haven't worked alone in YEARS, but when I did, I didn't entertain the coaches with any arguing over calls. Not paying for 2 umpires removes their right, in my mind, to come out and "argue" anything. Come out and there's a good chance that you're getting tossed.

[whistleone]

Originally posted by His High Holiness


Suggestion: Read more and post less. You are obviously too incompetent to contribute intelligently.

Peter

Am I the only one that finds this comment totally inappropriate?

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by Rich Fronheiser


There isn't enough cheese to feed the rats you had.

You need to squelch the bad behavior with some ejections. Don't take this kind of crap when working alone.

I would've confronted the coach who said "that wasn't a strike but we'll take it." That guy needed to go, as did all of them.

I haven't worked alone in YEARS, but when I did, I didn't entertain the coaches with any arguing over calls. Not paying for 2 umpires removes their right, in my mind, to come out and "argue" anything. Come out and there's a good chance that you're getting tossed.

I agree. I would tell the coaches in the pregame meeting, there is nothing for you to complain about. There is no way I can see everything as one umpire. That is why there are normally two and other levels have 3 in many cases. I usually say something to that affect right off the bat, then if I have to say something I might say, "remember what we talked about in the meeting." Then I do not have to say another word the rest of the game.

I have also not worked by myself in a few years and thank God have not had to worry about it. But I give these guys very little rope when that is the case.

And from my standpoint, I almost never had to do a game by myself when I started coming up. All the games I did in my first two or three years were all 2 man. The place I live now, all games at the non-varsity level are one man games. The place I started, that would only happen if someone just did not show up or there was a scheduling conflict. No wonder we are struggling for umpires around here.

Peace

[jicecone]

Originally posted by whistleone

Am I the only one that finds this comment totally inappropriate?

No, but there are some things we take for granted on this forum.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by whistleone

Am I the only one that finds this comment totally inappropriate?

Yes, but this is what Peter does. He puffs out his chest and thinks that everyone that has not achieved anything to his satisifaction is not just less of an umpire, but less of a human being.

ANYONE has the right to post on this board or any for that matter. As long as the go along with the conduct rules that the moderators set forth. But folks like Peter feel that he and some of his sorry friends should post what they feel fits in their world. They quickly forget that all of us at one time did not know everything there was about umpiring. Sometimes we had to fall on our faces before we realized that fact. But then again, there is a reason we look at some of the old-timers and wonder why they still are around. Peter is just on of many of those examples.

Peace

[mrm21711]

I hate guys who stick around and watch the teams shake hands or tell the coaches "good game" Who cares, first of all, and second of all what good does it do? Its another opportunity to find trouble while they should be in the parking lot with their partner. I hate that stuff.

[bigwes68]

If I feel like coaches and players have exhibited exceptional sportsmanship and have been very courteous to me the whole game, I will tell them after the game that I appreciate it. If not, I get the heck out of there.

I understand that there's no need to stick around any longer than you have to, but if you've had a good game, good coaches, good players, etc., I think you should be able to tell them that you appreciate their good behavior and that they made things a lot easier on you.

Just my opinion. Which I'm sure will be shot down quickly.