Strange Balk Call

[Jason Blakely]

Hello,

Runner on second, pitcher in the stretch. F4 feints to second as if a pick-off is on, but drops back to position when R2 shortens his lead. The pitcher, seeing F4's break for second, jump turns to pick - but half way in his jump realizes F4 has returned to position. The pitcher, already committed to throwing, manages to throw to F4 at his normal position 15-20 feet away from second base, so as not to throw it to centerfield.

Umpire calls a balk because the pitcher did not pick off to a base. Is this right?

Thanks,
Jason

[Rich]

Originally posted by Jason Blakely
Hello,

Runner on second, pitcher in the stretch. F4 feints to second as if a pick-off is on, but drops back to position when R2 shortens his lead. The pitcher, seeing F4's break for second, jump turns to pick - but half way in his jump realizes F4 has returned to position. The pitcher, already committed to throwing, manages to throw to F4 at his normal position 15-20 feet away from second base, so as not to throw it to centerfield.

Umpire calls a balk because the pitcher did not pick off to a base. Is this right?

Thanks,
Jason

No, unless the base in question is FIRST base.

[David B]

Originally posted by Jason Blakely
Hello,

Runner on second, pitcher in the stretch. F4 feints to second as if a pick-off is on, but drops back to position when R2 shortens his lead. The pitcher, seeing F4's break for second, jump turns to pick - but half way in his jump realizes F4 has returned to position. The pitcher, already committed to throwing, manages to throw to F4 at his normal position 15-20 feet away from second base, so as not to throw it to centerfield.

Umpire calls a balk because the pitcher did not pick off to a base. Is this right?

Thanks,
Jason

The umpire missed this one. There is no where that the rules say he must throw the ball to the base.

As Rich said, first base is different.

Thanks
David

[jumpmaster]

an arguement could be made that this is a balk b/c OBR 8.05c. F1 failed to step directly towards the base. He threw to F4. F4 is not at 2nd Base.

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by jumpmaster
an arguement could be made that this is a balk b/c OBR 8.05c. F1 failed to step directly towards the base. He threw to F4. F4 is not at 2nd Base.

You could make that arguement, but it's not the "correct" interpretation.

[woolnojg]

Have yet to see a "base" that can catch a throw.

[ecurebel]

I had something similar in an AAU 10u game. where they play federation rules with slight modification for these ages.

Righthanded F1 has toed the rubber in the stretch, with out stepping or anything he faints a throw to third without the ball in his throwing hand (it is in his glove) plate guy calls a balk stating that he deliberately decieved the runner by the fainted attempt. is this correct? or was he reading too much into the deception?

[jumpmaster]

QUOTE: "Righthanded F1 has toed the rubber in the stretch, with out stepping or anything he faints a throw to third without the ball in his throwing hand (it is in his glove) plate guy calls a balk stating that he deliberately decieved the runner by the fainted attempt. is this correct?"

----

yes

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quote:
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Originally posted by jumpmaster
an arguement could be made that this is a balk b/c OBR 8.05c. F1 failed to step directly towards the base. He threw to F4. F4 is not at 2nd Base.
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You could make that arguement, but it's not the "correct" interpretation.

---
what is the correct interpretation? Source, please.

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by jumpmaster
an arguement could be made that this is a balk b/c OBR 8.05c. F1 failed to step directly towards the base. He threw to F4. F4 is not at 2nd Base.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


You could make that arguement, but it's not the "correct" interpretation.

---
what is the correct interpretation? Source, please.

That since F1 is not required to throw at all, it doesn't matter that he doesn't throw to the base.

One or more of NAPBL, JEA, J/R, ML Umpires manual contains this.

[DG]

Originally posted by bob jenkins

That since F1 is not required to throw at all, it doesn't matter that he doesn't throw to the base.

One or more of NAPBL, JEA, J/R, ML Umpires manual contains this.

6.5(l) in PBUC Manual - "there is no violation if a pitcher attempts a pick off at second base and seeing no fielder covering the bag, throws to the shortstop or second baseman, neither of whom is in the vicinity of the bag nor is making an attempt to retire the runner".

[jumpmaster]

thanks for the info guys. You have helped me settle an argument in my association. I have said that this is not a balk b/c F1 is not required to throw.

I don't have any of the J/R, PBUC, etc. manuals. Do you have a suggestion of which is a must have and where can I purchase it? It is obvious from this board that these are must have items.

[DG]

Originally posted by jumpmaster
thanks for the info guys. You have helped me settle an argument in my association. I have said that this is not a balk b/c F1 is not required to throw.

I don't have any of the J/R, PBUC, etc. manuals. Do you have a suggestion of which is a must have and where can I purchase it? It is obvious from this board that these are must have items.

Baseball Rules Difference (BRD 2004), available on the main page of this site, is essential reading. PBUC Manual, IMO, is optional (but interesting) reading. You can call to order, go to http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com. There is also a good booklet on 2 man mechanics that you can order. I have heard about J/R but I have been buying BRD about every 2 years since I found out it existed and I ain't looking for 2 books in the bush.

[GarthB]

Originally posted by DG

Baseball Rules Difference (BRD 2004), available on the main page of this site, is essential reading. PBUC Manual, IMO, is optional (but interesting) reading.

Since the PBUC is official and the BRD is not, I would reverse that order.

Anyone working OBR games should have the PBUC manual. Anyone working multiple rules would be helped by owning the BRD.

[Kaliix]

You can buy either the PBUC Umpire Manual or the PBUC Manual for the Two Umpire System at Plus POS

Originally posted by jumpmaster
thanks for the info guys. You have helped me settle an argument in my association. I have said that this is not a balk b/c F1 is not required to throw.

I don't have any of the J/R, PBUC, etc. manuals. Do you have a suggestion of which is a must have and where can I purchase it? It is obvious from this board that these are must have items.

[LittleLeagueBob]

Baseball Rules Difference (BRD 2004), available on the main page of this site... [/B]

I'd like to get this, but I don't see it on the main page -- if someone can show me the way...

Thanks!