warming up - Page 2

gsf23 · #16 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2004, 12:11pm

Well...if you don't like the rule than that is your only option isn't it. Either call it like it says or don't. Just because something doesn't seem fair doesn't mean that we have to change it. Is it fair that you need to get four balls to walk but only three strikes to get out?? Seems the fair thing to do there is have only three balls for a walk or four strikes for an out.

And to the previous post...that was said to show that you can't be worried as an umpire if something is fair or not. Just make the call according to the rules and move on.

mcrowder · #17 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2004, 04:27pm

Sorry if I sounded offended or annoyed. I know some officials who would have said what you said, AND MEANT IT. That truly bothers me.

gsf23 · #18 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 14, 2004, 08:10pm

Or the guys who "look for outs" so they can get games over with. Had a partner on the bases, top of 7th, visitors behind and two outs, runners at second and third. Ground ball to short and the 1B has to stretch for the throw and pulls his foot. Partner on the bases rings him up. Of course coach goes nuts asking for help. My partner finally asks me, did he pull his foot? I say "Yes he did" and he then calls him safe. Vistors proceed to score five more runs. Home team loses. After the game my partner is all pissed off at me for making that call because we had to umpire for another 35 minutes. Got a new partner after that one.

cowbyfan1 · #19 (**permalink**) Tue Jan 20, 2004, 06:25am

Quote:

Originally posted by gsf23
Or the guys who "look for outs" so they can get games over with. Had a partner on the bases, top of 7th, visitors behind and two outs, runners at second and third. Ground ball to short and the 1B has to stretch for the throw and pulls his foot. Partner on the bases rings him up. Of course coach goes nuts asking for help. My partner finally asks me, did he pull his foot? I say "Yes he did" and he then calls him safe. Vistors proceed to score five more runs. Home team loses. After the game my partner is all pissed off at me for making that call because we had to umpire for another 35 minutes. Got a new partner after that one.

Good for you!! I hate people like that really. Let the players decide.
I was calling a quarter finals of a JV tourney. Scored tied in extras. Partner got piss cuz I would not change the way I call ball and strikes for the home team to get to get that "needed" run to end the game. Turns out the visitors win it and end up going to the finals to lose in extra innings there.
Call it like it should be called and not what you "need"

cbfoulds · #20 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 03, 2004, 11:30am

"after all, F5 is a DOOFUS too for not just stepping on 3rd."
Which is why we are OF COURSE going to score the run. Also, 'cause we would have to make up a "rule" not to - the run crossed the plate before the non-force out.

soonerfan · #21 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2004, 03:34pm

run does not count....here's my intepretation and how arrived there.......

since the bases were loaded and the hit ball FORCED the runners to go to the next base...a timing play cannot occurr until each runner has reached the next base safely. so...since the runner coming from second to third had never reached third....he can still be FORCED out to end the inning and prevent a timing play.

if i were working that game, that is what i would have ruled with no doubt in my own mind. how can you have a timing play when not all force plays are not over with??? unless i misunderstood the post.

soonerfan · #22 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2004, 03:39pm

....let me also address SOUTHUMP's ruling logic. the passing of a preceeding runner ruling is a call made once the ball is no longer live. so, which happens first? the tagging of R2 for the force and final out (that wuld cause the play to end)...or the passing of a preceeding runner? since the FORCE out would have to occurr first, i would rule that is the out that i base my interpretation on.

cbfoulds · #23 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2004, 07:02pm

Hey soonerfan:

The third out was the runner passing R2, NOT a tag (or force) of R2. Doesn't matter that R2 COULD be forced out, he wasn't; and for the real bizaro "what if's ...", the force on R2 was removed the instant he was passed by the following runner, who was instantly out (sorry, no "call made when the ball is no longer live..." factor applies - the OUT happens the instant the runner is passed), so we aren't going to deal with an advantageous 4th out scenario. The only situation where the failure of a runner to reach his base makes a difference is on the batter-runner going to first. If the 3d out is on BR before he reaches 1st, it doesn't matter how BR is out, the run won't score. Except on a BR, the run scores on the time play if it is not a force out.

soonerfan · #24 (**permalink**) Wed Feb 18, 2004, 10:08am

cbfoulds:

then i guess i am on the wagon with some of the others here...seems pretty odd that the rules have that "loophole" in them. i still contest that what i posted would be what i would have called, allthough it seems to be inaccurate here, because the logic i used seems just that...logical...and i could explain why i called it that way with further confidence. what you typed seems like i would mis-quote it more easily and dig a deep hole for myself.