Catcher "framing" a pitch

[CoachP]

Keep hearing this lately....especially Rod Allen doing the Tiger games.

Does that really exist? Or is that just coach/announcer speak?

I would think the Umpire behind the plate can see the ball cross the plate without any of the catchers help, but then again, I've never been behind the plate.

[Mrumpiresir]

A good catcher "frames" a pitch by catching it properly and holding it giving the umpire a good view.

Do not confuse framing a pitch with dragging it into the zone, which any competent umpire will call a ball. After all, there is only one reason a catcher will drag a pitch, which is because he believes it was outside the zone.

[CoachP]

So basically a good catcher "just catches the ball" ?

Like I said, never been behind the plate. Is it hard to see the ball cross the plate? Or just certain pitches?

And do Umpires get involved in the pitchers thinking? As in looking for a fastball or looking for a slider and get fooled?

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by CoachP

So basically a good catcher "just catches the ball" ?

No, it's more nuanced than that. A good catcher catches the ball in a manner that gives the umpire a clear look at the pitch and removes doubt from his mind that it was a strike. A catcher that sets up, sticks the pitch and isn't moving his glove all over the place or dropping the ball is doing a proper job of framing.

For example, on a low pitch at the knees, I'm more likely to ball a pitch if the catcher is turning his glove over and looks like he is digging it out. A catcher that keeps his thumb down with little or no glove movement is more likely to get a strike on that same pitch.

This of course varies by level and talent of the catchers. Sometimes you need to get strikes anyway you can.

[DG]

Originally Posted by CoachP

So basically a good catcher "just catches the ball" ?

Like I said, never been behind the plate. Is it hard to see the ball cross the plate? Or just certain pitches?

And do Umpires get involved in the pitchers thinking? As in looking for a fastball or looking for a slider and get fooled?

Yes. No, but outside is not as easy as other pitches, so if the catcher catches a borderline properly he can help the decision.

Pitchers thinking is more a function of the pitcher, the catcher, and the level of play. Remember Bull Durham? But yes, if a pitcher has an 0-2 count on fastballs, and has a good slider, the umpire would not expect a fastball over the middle, but will call whatever comes. If the pitcher throws a slider on the outside corner and catcher sticks it, sit down.

Good umpires also get involved in game situation thinking, when is a hit and run most likely, sacrifice bunt, steal, pick-off, etc. It helps to know enough to anticipate what might happen and be ready for it but call whatever does happen.

[CoachPaul]

Originally Posted by DG

Good umpires also get involved in game situation thinking, when is a hit and run most likely, sacrifice bunt, steal, pick-off, etc. It helps to know enough to anticipate what might happen and be ready for it but call whatever does happen.

Even before I was an umpire, I think about the situation of any baseball game I watch. I'm strategizing between every pitch. I think it's why some of us can watch baseball and others think it's boring.

It's like how football drives me crazy because instead of allowing me to see the personnel groupings coming on and off the field, the broadcast shoves replays down my throat that I don't really care about. I saw the play the first time! If I want to see it again, I'll rewind it!

I've never umpired for someone throwing over 90 mph, but in general if pitchers are throwing sub-85 mph, there really is no fooling the umpire. There is enough time to adjust.

I wish some catchers had better reflexes though. I'd rather have the catcher thinking fastball and get a curve instead of the other way around. Why do those always seem to go straight at my mask?

Also, on another point, the strike zone doesn't move, so it doesn't matter where the catcher sets up. If it's over the plate, it's over the plate. Grab all the strikes you can. Managers can't argue balls and strikes anyway. I was watching yesterday's Red Sox v Mets game and that plate umpire was calling a ton of strikes as balls simply on how the catchers were setting up. He should lose his job! It was the worst plate call I've seen in a while and I've watched CB Bucknor call a game.

[cbailey]

Originally Posted by CoachP

So basically a good catcher "just catches the ball" ?

Like I said, never been behind the plate. Is it hard to see the ball cross the plate? Or just certain pitches?

And do Umpires get involved in the pitchers thinking? As in looking for a fastball or looking for a slider and get fooled?

For me, it's more about the catcher giving me a pitch that I can call a strike. If he's moving his glove all over, chances are he's not getting a strike. If he can stick a pitch, even if it's a little out of the zone, he's giving me a pitch I can call a strike.....it doesn't guarantee a strike, but it gives him a much better chance. Other things come into the consideration as well......consistency of a pitcher, is he hitting his spots, etc. It's not just about the strike zone......if the catcher sets up inside, but has to reach outside for a pitch, it's a ball, even if it catches the outside corner. That's not a pitch that I can sell as a strike.

[robbie]

Originally Posted by cbailey

For me, it's more about the catcher giving me a pitch that I can call a strike. If he's moving his glove all over, chances are he's not getting a strike. If he can stick a pitch, even if it's a little out of the zone, he's giving me a pitch I can call a strike.....it doesn't guarantee a strike, but it gives him a much better chance. Other things come into the consideration as well......consistency of a pitcher, is he hitting his spots, etc. It's not just about the strike zone......if the catcher sets up inside, but has to reach outside for a pitch, it's a ball, even if it catches the outside corner. That's not a pitch that I can sell as a strike.

wow!

[cbailey]

Originally Posted by robbie

wow!

wow all you want.....not getting my ass chewed for rewarding a pitcher/catcher who can't hit their spots.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Mrumpiresir

A good catcher "frames" a pitch by catching it properly and holding it giving the umpire a good view.

Do not confuse framing a pitch with dragging it into the zone, which any competent umpire will call a ball. After all, there is only one reason a catcher will drag a pitch, which is because he believes it was outside the zone.

I've found that a lot of catchers just aren't taught right these days and try to drag every pitch to the center of the plate. I don't throw away strikes.

[Mrumpiresir]

Originally Posted by Rich

I've found that a lot of catchers just aren't taught right these days and try to drag every pitch to the center of the plate. I don't throw away strikes.

The situation arises on marginal pitches. I want the catcher to stick a pitch which is on the outside edge of the plate so I can determine if it caught the zone. If he drags the pitch, he has taken that view away from me and everyone in the park saw him do that. The benefit of the doubt now goes to the batter.

I don't like to throw away strikes either but the catcher needs to help me out here, especially at HS varsity and above..

[Rufus]

I've always taught my catchers their #1 job (besides not letting any balls get through to hit the plate ump - ahem!) was receiving the ball and keeping strikes strikes (i.e., not letting their glove travel out of the zone after receiving the ball).

There are techniques of teaching receiving that don't lend themselves to written description, but the main point is giving the umpire the best possible view of the where the ball is (and isn't) when it settles in the glove (with the full knowledge this is past the strike zone).

You'd be amazed at how many people are concerned about "pop" times and fielding and don't pay attention to the supposedly simple, but actually quite difficult, skill of receiving pitches.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Mrumpiresir

The situation arises on marginal pitches. I want the catcher to stick a pitch which is on the outside edge of the plate so I can determine if it caught the zone. If he drags the pitch, he has taken that view away from me and everyone in the park saw him do that. The benefit of the doubt now goes to the batter.

I don't like to throw away strikes either but the catcher needs to help me out here, especially at HS varsity and above..

I don't throw away strikes at the HS or small college levels. I don't expect good catching anymore.

[rcaverly]

Originally Posted by Mrumpiresir

Do not confuse framing a pitch with dragging it into the zone, which any competent umpire will call a ball. After all, there is only one reason a catcher will drag a pitch, which is because he believes it was outside the zone.

A good catcher won't take a strike and try to make it a better strike.

[Rich]

I wonder who's doing all the chewing. I don't throw away strikes and nobody's bitching. Hasn't hurt my assignments in the least bit.


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