Coach leaves bench to sit in the stands.

[Illini_Ref]

An assistant for Team A sits on the bench during the first half. After halftime he comes out and sits in the front row of the stands on the opposite end of the floor from his bench and across the floor. He shouts instructions from his seat. At one point he goes to the team huddle during a timeout and then returns to his seat in the bleachers.

Legal? Unsporting? Penalized?

[vbzebra]

Originally Posted by Illini_Ref

An assistant for Team A sits on the bench during the first half. After halftime he comes out and sits in the front row of the stands on the opposite end of the floor from his bench and across the floor. He shouts instructions from his seat. At one point he goes to the team huddle during a timeout and then returns to his seat in the bleachers.

Legal? Unsporting? Penalized?

Don't have rulebook with me, but I'm guessing T for leaving the coaching box? Or, maybe go to game management about a "fan" entering the court going to a team's huddle?

[Adam]

If he decides to be a fan, he's out of my jurisdiction as far as shouting instructions to his players. In JV games, you hear the varsity coaches do it all the time. Once he joins the huddle, though, I'll warn the HC if I'm feeling generous.

You have two options.
1. Have the fan removed for entering the court.
2. Charge a T to the assistant coach for leaving the bench (the box is irrelevant for an assistant coach); don't forget to give the HC his indirect.

[vbzebra]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

If he decides to be a fan, he's out of my jurisdiction as far as shouting instructions to his players. In JV games, you hear the varsity coaches do it all the time. Once he joins the huddle, though, I'll warn the HC if I'm feeling generous.

You have two options.
1. Have the fan removed for entering the court.
2. Charge a T to the assistant coach for leaving the bench (the box is irrelevant for an assistant coach); don't forget to give the HC his indirect.

oh yeah, good call with #2!

[just another ref]

I don't really see anything illegal here. This seems like the flipside to the countless references which have been made about the ac being a nonperson.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by just another ref

I don't really see anything illegal here. This seems like the flipside to the countless references which have been made about the ac being a nonperson.

Those references are all tongue-in-cheek. An AC is bench peronnel, and must adhere to those rules. If he wants to give up being a coach for the game, I'm fine with it. He's not, however, going to join the huddles for timeouts or intermissions. He's either in or he's out, he doesn't get it both ways.

And if I get the impression that he's made that move in order to have free reign to criticize the refs; he'll be disappointed.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by Illini_Ref

An assistant for Team A sits on the bench during the first half. After halftime he comes out and sits in the front row of the stands on the opposite end of the floor from his bench and across the floor. He shouts instructions from his seat. At one point he goes to the team huddle during a timeout and then returns to his seat in the bleachers.

Legal? Unsporting? Penalized?

Blue: If a coach has changed his official status with the team, then it should be reported to the officials at the nearest opportunity. However, there is no penalty for not doing so.

Purple: the officials should not allow this. If the "coach" fails to comply, it is a technical foul.

[Illini_Ref]

I totally agree. This is being discussed on another board and one poster insists that it is nothing. I can't buy that. At the very least, when he comes back, especially after "coaching" from the stands, it should be called as an unsporting foul.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Illini_Ref

I totally agree. This is being discussed on another board and one poster insists that it is nothing. I can't buy that. At the very least, when he comes back, especially after "coaching" from the stands, it should be called as an unsporting foul.

And many have said that there is no rules coverage and that a T would not be appropriate. That is a fan site, this is an official's site. You should realize there is a difference in the comments.

Oh well.

Peace

[agr8zebra]

Let the HC make the decision for you. Go to HC, and ask who that person was who just joined his team huddle, if he says it is one of my assistance, T his AC up and sit the HC, if he says he fan, walk over to the administrator and have the fan removed from the gym.

[Illini_Ref]

And four (that's a majority) of the officials responding here feel that a technical foul COULD be issued.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Illini_Ref

And four (that's a majority) of the officials responding here feel that a technical foul COULD be issued.

Brian,

Let me pull a little rank one you. I am not going to publish the email that was sent between another official and our head guy on this. But you are not a clinician with the State of Illinois. You are just an official. I am a clinician with the state of Illinois in basketball and one thing I have learned is to contact guys like Harry B (head clinician and head rules interpreter for the State of Illinois, who I also know very well and work for in both high school and college) or the IHSA office if I am not clear. The KG clarified what I basically said on this. KG made it clear that this could be handled by game management and suggests that this was the likely scenario as I had said originally and all along in our discussion over there.

There are not many people here that live in our state, but if this happens in their area I would suggest they do the same thing and contact the powers that be. And you have people that do not agree with you as to make the AC stay at the bench. They are handling the very same way I suggested as did the administrator of boys basketball. This is why I said to file a Special Report in the first place. Because it seems that the only people that took action to contact the IHSA was an official that did so based on a discussion board conversation. The officials on the game did not do so and certainly not the teams involved in the game in question. I also did not hear that the officials gave a T or even had the guy removed. So they did not even notice the behavior or decided to do nothing at all. You do not have to agree with me, but I stand by what I said and really do not see the big deal. When you work a game you are responsible for you actions or behavior and judgments. I have earned the right to take many positions and take action appropriately with the higher ups. I have never seen this nor do I feel this is a tragedy as you have made this out to be. Maybe you have not been in that position, but I have as an administrator. And I get asked all the time personally about situations and I contact those that know more than me what we should do so there is consistency.

[tjones1]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

Blue: If a coach has changed his official status with the team, then it should be reported to the officials at the nearest opportunity. However, there is no penalty for not doing so.

Purple: the officials should not allow this. If the "coach" fails to comply, it is a technical foul.

I agree with this.

There's nothing that prohibits a coach from sitting in the stands and scouting/gathering information. However, I would say that coach may not communicate with the team for the rest of the game.

If this happened, this is the probably the only way I would notice a coach doing this if they went to the huddle. I would not allow the coach to be apart of the huddle and if they failed to comply then I would charge them with a technical foul.

With that said, I think you could charge a technical foul for the coach returning to the huddle, if you saw him coaching in the stands. That is unsporting and not within fair play and the spirit of the rules. However, as I said before, that's not how I would handle it.

[Judtech]

I thought this thread was about the dearly departed Ricky Birdsong formely of Northwestern (RIP)

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Illini_Ref

An assistant for Team A sits on the bench during the first half. After halftime he comes out and sits in the front row of the stands on the opposite end of the floor from his bench and across the floor. He shouts instructions from his seat. At one point he goes to the team huddle during a timeout and then returns to his seat in the bleachers.

Legal? Unsporting? Penalized?

Personally I've got nothing. If he is not disrupting the game I probably wouldn't even notice his movements. If the other team complained then I would advise Game Admin that there is a person coming from the stands and joining the team huddle. I'm thinking that would probably force Coach A to make a decision as to where he wants his AC to spend the rest of the game.