Scholarships

[Dukat]

On some other posts the subject of scholarships came up in response to parents pushing their girls into playing. With this same vein I have heard the arguments against girls playing slow pitch ball toward fast pitch ball. IMHO I would rather watch/coach/umpire a girl’s slow pitch game than fast pitch any day and I have seen/heard many girls give the same opinion but the parents feel they must play only fast pitch or they will never got a scholarship. My take is let them play the sport they want to play or play both in different seasons and let the other take care of itself because as Mike stated in another post...There are not that many scholarships around and the odds of her getting one anyway are slim. Also this year at my daughters 14U ASA Slow Pitch Nationals tournament a few Georgia coaches told our team that Slow Pitch is coming back and taking back over as the sport of choice over fast pitch in their areas while here I have noticed a steady decline even though in Mississippi we are holding on as long as we can. Other opinions on this?

[Dakota]

Mumblings of a fast pitch umpire (i.e. take it for what it's worth - maybe very little):

Slow pitch removes two skill positions as factors in the game - the battery. Therefore, it is easier for smaller communities / schools to field competitive teams.

It also de-emphasizes hitting skill (i.e. timing the pitch, watching for junk, etc.) and emphasizes hitting power. Therefore, smaller girls may be at a disadvantage.

Around here, there are some JO slow pitch teams (summer and school), but they are far outnumbered by the fast pitch teams.

[Dukat]

Originally posted by Dakota
Mumblings of a fast pitch umpire (i.e. take it for what it's worth - maybe very little):

Slow pitch removes two skill positions as factors in the game - the battery. Therefore, it is easier for smaller communities / schools to field competitive teams.

It also de-emphasizes hitting skill (i.e. timing the pitch, watching for junk, etc.) and emphasizes hitting power. Therefore, smaller girls may be at a disadvantage.

Granted from a biased Slow Pitch Lover but:

But fast pitch de-emphasizes defense as a whole and basically says if you have an awesome pitcher and catcher you can field the other positions with junk and still be competitive whereas in Slow Pitch every player must be a good defensive player.

[Skahtboi]

Originally posted by Dukat
Granted from a biased Slow Pitch Lover but:

But fast pitch de-emphasizes defense as a whole and basically says if you have an awesome pitcher and catcher you can field the other positions with junk and still be competitive whereas in Slow Pitch every player must be a good defensive player.

I don't know where you have been watching FP! Around here, if you go to a 12U and up, (14U, 16U, 18U and adult), you will see the ball put into play on a regular basis, and some damn fine defensive play. I have seen some incredible shoe-string catches, great double plays, and players gunned down at first (something you never see in SP) by a center fielder...etc. Overall, IMO, FP is more of a "total" game.

IMHO I would rather watch/coach/umpire a girl’s slow pitch game than fast pitch any day and I have seen/heard many girls give the same opinion but the parents feel they must play only fast pitch or they will never got a scholarship.

My daughter tried both when she was younger. She absolutely hated SP, and yet I encouraged her to give it yet another try, partially because back in those days I was still playing SP as well. She came away from her second season still hating it. She has never played, nor expressed a desire to since. There were two other players who played FP with her who had the same opinion of SP. They all felt it didn't challenge them enough.

There's my two cents worth on the argument!

[IRISHMAFIA]

Well, from someone who has played both and umpired both, I'll take SP any day.

I completely disagree with Tom's assertion that there is no skill in hitting in SP. As I've noted before, I've umpired games involving Major League players and have seen them strike out swinging! It is all about the timing and, yes, there are junk pitches in SP. The biggest problem many SP players have is that you have time to think about it and that will just kill you.

As far as the battery is concerned, I will take exception to that statement. A good pitcher is important, but many do not understand what their job is. A good SP can throw strikes while mixing up the height of the pitches. They can also throw a junker when necessary and know the hitters that will chase junk. If a pitcher can field the middle, that is icing on the cake. The catcher, especially at the higher levels where stealing is permitted, must be on top of the game. A good catcher is like a conductor, directing the team from the only position which can see the entire team's set at one time. They will also remind the infielders of their options prior to the pitch.

They also know the batters and their tendencies, can help remind the pitcher of the hitter's weakness and stop the ball from hitting the umpire (MOST important point). But one of the most underrated things a catcher does in SP is talk. It doesn't make any difference what they say, just make a noise. Pick a subject and run at the mouth. It can drive some batters crazy, just make sure they do not talk about or address a member of the offense.


Y'all have too many memories of when you played keg ball. Or maybe that was holes in your memory

It isn't the same game any more.

[whiskers_ump]

Originally posted by Dakota
Mumblings of a fast pitch umpire (i.e. take it for what it's worth - maybe very little):

Slow pitch removes two skill positions as factors in the game - the battery. Therefore, it is easier for smaller communities / schools to field competitive teams.

It also de-emphasizes hitting skill (i.e. timing the pitch, watching for junk, etc.) and emphasizes hitting power. Therefore, smaller girls may be at a disadvantage.

Around here, there are some JO slow pitch teams (summer and school), but they are far outnumbered by the fast pitch teams.

I agree with Tom on the underlined portions of his statement.
There is so little slow-pitch around here, that groups trying to have
fund raisers, have switched to flag football. Co-Ed style.

glen

[KBoy]

I've lurked here for quite a while, but have decided to add my two cents.

Both slow pitch and fast pitch are great games, but just because they use a bat and softball shouldn't be compared. Both required skills, but not necessarily the same ones.

I grew up loving slow pitch because of the action in the field, but have soured toward it because of the bat technology. I still play slow pitch but prefer to umpire fast and especially good modified pitch.

[18597]

As someone who has played and is currently umpiring both, give me a fastpitch game any day of the week. As several people as mentioned previously, they are two different games. But in SP, I find a much greater number of AAs who think they are god's gift to ball, but for some reason are playing on a C or D level team. Go figure.

[DownTownTonyBrown]

Originally posted by 18597
But in SP, I find a much greater number of AAs who think they are god's gift to ball,

Yeah, adult slow pitch teams seem to attract a lot of alcoholics...

I'm with Mike on the fact that slow pitch pitchers have a lot of impact on the game - there is a tremendous amount of variability that they control. Are they comparable in athletic ability to fast pitch players? I wouldn't say so. But slow pitch isn't T-ball either - the pitcher's have a definite impact. The batter's ability to place the ball has a definite impact that is not generally seen in fast pitch or baseball.

They are completely different games to umpire, play, or experience.

At the adult level, I enjoy working fast pitch above slow pitch. At the high shool level, I enjoy baseball above softball. You want to work for the best athletes you can and those are generally in baseball or fast pitch softball.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by DownTownTonyBrown


At the adult level, I enjoy working fast pitch above slow pitch. At the high shool level, I enjoy baseball above softball. You want to work for the best athletes you can and those are generally in baseball or fast pitch softball.

I'm glad you said generally. And, remember, being "athletic" is not the same as being a sport-specific skilled player.

If you want to keep this belief, do not go to a Major-level SP game, 'cause those guys are athletes all the way. And, even though the military team doesn't always fair that well at the ASA Major tournament, if you go to the Interservice Championships, you will find nothing, but athletes on the SP field.

I've worked a load of SP games with adults which are as athletic.

Come to think of it, I don't believe it is fair to make such a general statement to the effect of athleticism and the different games.

JMHO,

Mike

[Dakota]

I wasn't intending to make value judgments, just a couple of semi-factual observations that may relate to why some communities favor JO SP and others JO FP.

I think it is a given that at the higher levels of nearly any sport (Bass fishing may be an exception ), nearly all of the players are athletes. And, I accept that a highly skilled SP pitcher can be a valuable asset to a team.

However, looking at school-girl ball, smaller communitites may find it easier to be competitive in SP than they would be at FP if they lack a highly coached FP pitcher and a catcher adept at stopping the steal.

And, again, looking at school-girl ball, assuming JO SP emphasizes power hitting (and by extension de-emphasizes the short game), this may work against smaller kids making the team.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by Dakota
I wasn't intending to make value judgments, just a couple of semi-factual observations that may relate to why some communities favor JO SP and others JO FP.

I think it is a given that at the higher levels of nearly any sport (Bass fishing may be an exception ), nearly all of the players are athletes. And, I accept that a highly skilled SP pitcher can be a valuable asset to a team.

However, looking at school-girl ball, smaller communitites may find it easier to be competitive in SP than they would be at FP if they lack a highly coached FP pitcher and a catcher adept at stopping the steal.

And, again, looking at school-girl ball, assuming JO SP emphasizes power hitting (and by extension de-emphasizes the short game), this may work against smaller kids making the team.

Maybe it's not so much finding it easier to be competitive, but easier to find more participants.

[CecilOne]

Youth SP is just another symptom of the physical degradation and increased wimpiness of our society. Not to mention the laziness of coaches who have less to deal within SP.

disclaimer: This is not intended to refute anyone else's glorification of adult SP.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by CecilOne
Youth SP is just another symptom of the physical degradation and increased wimpiness of our society. Not to mention the laziness of coaches who have less to deal within SP.

disclaimer: This is not intended to refute anyone else's glorification of adult SP.

I understand your disclaimer and I am not taking offense to this post.

However, I am curious as to what brings you to those beliefs.

[Elaine "Lady Blue"]

Originally posted by Dukat
On some other posts the subject of scholarships came up in response to parents pushing their girls into playing. With this same vein I have heard the arguments against girls playing slow pitch ball toward fast pitch ball. IMHO I would rather watch/coach/umpire a girl’s slow pitch game than fast pitch any day and I have seen/heard many girls give the same opinion but the parents feel they must play only fast pitch or they will never got a scholarship. My take is let them play the sport they want to play or play both in different seasons and let the other take care of itself because as Mike stated in another post...There are not that many scholarships around and the odds of her getting one anyway are slim. Also this year at my daughters 14U ASA Slow Pitch Nationals tournament a few Georgia coaches told our team that Slow Pitch is coming back and taking back over as the sport of choice over fast pitch in their areas while here I have noticed a steady decline even though in Mississippi we are holding on as long as we can. Other opinions on this?

Dukat,

I don't know the SP coaches from Georgia that you spoke with, but they MUST have been DREAMING! SP is not coming back and taking over in Georgia. Heck, the 18U SP state in Georgia was cancelled due to lack of teams, and only 6-8 teams in the other age brackets.
There are very few pockets of SP, mostly for rec, just a hand full of High Schools, and I don't know of any colleges that play SP, unless they're very small.
FP teams have mulitiplied by leaps and bounds in the past 12 years in Georgia; new parks, new leagues, new travel team organizations, etc. Many are Nationally known and Nationally ranked.
The South in general, will never go back to the SP strong hold for JO girls that was 18-20 years ago--IMHO and IM informed opionion.