Pitching Question- NFHS Rules

[BretMan]

Here is a question that a coach brought to me (NFHS rules).

Pitcher engages rubber, takes signs with hands separated. She then brings her hands together as she starts her pitching motion. Hands separate...then come back together again before separating a second time and delivering the pitch.

Illegal pitch? Seems like a no-brainer. But which NFHS rule covers this?

[Manny A]

How about 6-1-4b: the pitcher does not use a rocker action in which, after having the ball in both hands in pitching position, she removes one hand from the ball, takes a backward and forward swing and returns the ball to both hands in front of the body.

[BretMan]

Nobody said nuthin' about "taking a backward and forward swing".

So, if she holds her hands out in front of her body, can she join and separate her hands twice (or more) without penalty?

[CecilOne]

The pitch begins when the hands separate, rejoining is starting and not delivering.

[RKBUmp]

What Cecil said, NFHS 6-1-2-a, The pitch starts when one hand is taken off the ball.....

My internet connection where Im at is so slow I cant get to the video, but NFHS does have a video of illegal pitches named Double Touch.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by RKBUmp

What Cecil said, NFHS 6-1-2-a, The pitch starts when one hand is taken off the ball.....

My internet connection where Im at is so slow I cant get to the video, but NFHS does have a video of illegal pitches named Double Touch.

You need to be a member of the NFHS Officials Association to view the video.

The example used in the video is a pitcher who brings her hands together, separates them to adjust her hair, and brings them back together to deliver the pitch. The narrator explains it is an illegal pitch "as soon as the pitcher separates her hands after bringing them together without immediately delivering the ball".

[RKBUmp]

I have the video on my computer and I believe also have it on my youtube site, but my connection is to slow.

[BretMan]

It surprised me that the only NFHS rule specifically mentioning a double touch has all of the odd qualifiers about first swinging the arms back then forward. If a double touch is illegal, you would think they just say so, like most other rule sets do.

I did look at the video and it's obvious that none of that arm swinging stuff is going on there.

[Manny A]

The problem is, double-touch violations almost always happen when the pitcher hasn't started a motion to pitch. They are simply a separation of the hands to do something other than begin the delivery motion, such as adjust the hair, swat at a fly, rub dust out the eyes, adjust the ball in the glove, etc. And after the hands separate and are joined again, the pitcher is still standing there and has made no windup motion.

What you're describing is a second joining of the hands while the pitcher is making her motion to deliver. The closest rule to saying that's illegal is 6-1-4b; certainly 6-1-2a doesn't prohibit the pitcher from rejoining the hands as she's making her pitching motion with the rest of her body.

6-1-4 lists what the pitcher cannot do as she's using any desired windup motion. Nothing there that says she can't bring her hands back together except under "b". One could argue that the premise for this being illegal is the second joining of the hands during the windup, not the swinging of the arms while they're seperated.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Manny A

The problem is, double-touch violations almost always happen when the pitcher hasn't started a motion to pitch. They are simply a separation of the hands to do something other than begin the delivery motion, such as adjust the hair, swat at a fly, rub dust out the eyes, adjust the ball in the glove, etc. And after the hands separate and are joined again, the pitcher is still standing there and has made no windup motion.

Well, whether the pitcher is intentional or not,, by rule the pitch starts when the hands separate the first time. Everything you mentioned can be done PRIOR to stepping on the PP and this is what the coaches need to coach, but I will bet that is rarely stated to the pitcher until it becomes a problem.