Infield Fly Rule

[Centerfield9]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

I think " retouch and advance after the ball is touched" assumes a catch.

There is nothing in the SOFTBALL rules that says the runners must retouch/tag up after a non-catch. So they do not have to.

EXACTLY! On any other flyball, the runners do not have to retouch their base after the ball is touched (and dropped) by the fielder. But in the case of the IFF, they do. Otherwise, why would MLB say "retouch and advance after the ball is touched?"

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by Centerfield9

EXACTLY! On any other flyball, the runners do not have to retouch their base after the ball is touched (and dropped) by the fielder. But in the case of the IFF, they do. Otherwise, why would MLB say "retouch and advance after the ball is touched?"

Do you agree that as soon as the batted ball reaches its apex in MLB, that the IFF rule is in effect? Of course you do. Now, carefully go back and read what you, yourself, posted:

"The ball is alive and runners may advance at the risk of the ball being caught...."

The ball is alive and the runners may advance at the risk of the ball being caught. Notice there is no mention of tagging up or anything at this point, yet the IFF is already in effect. The rest of your citation in bold from the post I copied this from goes on to explain how a runner may advance if the ball is caught, which is, at first touch, if the runner has tagged up, they may now advance.

No need to complicate things.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Centerfield9

EXACTLY! On any other flyball, the runners do not have to retouch their base after the ball is touched (and dropped) by the fielder. But in the case of the IFF, they do. Otherwise, why would MLB say "retouch and advance after the ball is touched?"

If the ball isn't caught, the runner doesn't have to retouch. If the ball is caught, the runner must retouch on the TOUCH preceding the catch, which is what the rule is trying to say.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Centerfield9

EXACTLY! On any other flyball, the runners do not have to retouch their base after the ball is touched (and dropped) by the fielder. But in the case of the IFF, they do. Otherwise, why would MLB say "retouch and advance after the ball is touched?"

You can either be an umpire, and get this simple concept ... or you can be a lawyer, and try to lawyerese this into meaning something it doesn't mean. But if you're going to be a lawyer, you need to take into account the ENTIRETY of this rule, and not just pluck one partial sentence and use it out of context.

Either way, you're interpretation is wrong. You're being told so by people who would know. Believe us... or don't. Your call, really.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Centerfield9

EXACTLY! On any other flyball, the runners do not have to retouch their base after the ball is touched (and dropped) by the fielder. But in the case of the IFF, they do. Otherwise, why would MLB say "retouch and advance after the ball is touched?"

OK, I guess I was not clear, hoped the brief version would be; but I'm not re-explaining what others have covered so well.

[nopachunts]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

OK, I guess I was not clear, hoped the brief version would be; but I'm not re-explaining what others have covered so well.

Isn't this thread something like you can give a horse water but your can't make it drink it?

[HugoTafurst]

Originally Posted by nopachunts

Isn't this thread something like you can give a horse water but your can't make it drink it?

"LEAD a horse to water......"

[Manny A]

Just for grits and shins, let's assume the ruleswriters wanted us to take the literal interpretation of the IFF rule that the OP is using. He (I assume male) argues that runners have to retouch their bases after the infield fly ball is first touched.

Ok, so suppose the infield fly ball falls to the ground, completely untouched. By that narrowly-restricting language in the IFF rule--"or retouch and advance after the ball is touched"--you could argue that the runners have to stay anchored to their bases until a fielder finally goes over and physically touches the ball!

That's the problem you can get into by, as MD alludes, lawyerizing the rules. No way in hell are we going to make the runners maintain contact with their bases until a fielder picks up that ball, even though that's what the rule, by strict interpretation, tells us has to happen.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Manny A

That's the problem you can get into by, as MD alludes, lawyerizing the rules.

Yeppers. Look what "lawyerizing" (love that new word) has done for this country. If you take a good look, you would be running to burn down every law school in the country. So what do you think it would do to a game of softball?

[Centerfield9]

I appreciate everyone's response. I'm not a lawyer; I'm just trying to understand the rule as it is written. After re-reading that sentence, it still doesn't make sense to me. It would be better if MLB would simply remove "retouch and advance after the ball is touched," then it would eliminate a possible exception to "as in any flyball."

[Rita C]

Originally Posted by Centerfield9

EXACTLY! On any other flyball, the runners do not have to retouch their base after the ball is touched (and dropped) by the fielder. But in the case of the IFF, they do. Otherwise, why would MLB say "retouch and advance after the ball is touched?"

Part of learning the rules of baseball and softball is learning how the rules are read.

I and the other umpires have told you: Except for the fact that the batter is out on an IFF regardless of whether or not the ball is caught, it is just like ANY other fly ball.

What that means is, that a runner does not need to retouch if the ball is not caught.

It's as simple as that.

Rita