Infield Fly Rule

[Bandit]

Ok guys. PLease bear with me and the long explination. Need an answer here that I can print and take to an umpire working with me during the winter. Here was the situation: 12 & Under, FP, Nobody out, bases loaded. Batter takes a full swing and puts a flyball in the area between first, second, and the pitching circle. I call INFIELD FLY. The runners are off with the ball being hit. All three fielders stop thinking the other one will catch it. The ball hits the ground with terrible back spin and goes foul between home plate and first base. No fielder touches it. Two runs score and batter-runner ends up on second. I call time speak to my partner and say I never say anyone touch the ball and think it is simply a foul ball. Did he see anything differently. He says no. We put everyone back and start with the count showing one more strike. Both coaches are very content with this ruling. After the game my partner says it was a good thing that nothing came of the play because he had an appeal on any of the runners which had started the play on a base. I ask what kind of appeal. He says "leaving early". I ask him why and add that the ball was never caught and the runners were simply very lucky. He says no, according to the rule on Infield Fly and when it is declared. All runners must not leave the base until the ball has been touched by a fielder or has touched the ground. I found the office copy of the rule book and read him the Rule from the Rule 1 section and he believes I am missapplying the rule. How can I explain this.

[Edited by Bandit on Dec 3rd, 2003 at 11:01 PM]

[bluezebra]

"All runners must not leave the base until the ball has been touched by a fielder or has touched the ground"

I have worked EVERY level of fast pitch and baseball, and there is NO rule that states this ridiculous interpretation. An infield fly, as far as the runners are concerned, is treated as any other fly ball. If the ball is caught, runners must tag-up before leaving their bases.

Tell your partner he needs to study the rules, and their interpretations, more closely. And tell your association instructional chairman (if you have one) to explain the rule to this guy. He needs some serious instructing.

Bob

[Dakota]

The ONLY thing the infield fly does (assuming the ball remains fair, which yours didn't) is to remove the force by declaring the BR out.

Everything else remains the same as with any other fly ball.

Excerpt from ASA Rule 1 - INFIELD FLY:
"The ball is live and runners may advance at the risk of the ball being caught. The runners can tag up and advance once the batted ball is touched (prior to catching), the same as on any fly ball. If a declared infield fly becomes a foul ball, it is treated the same as any foul."

Notice: the same as on any fly ball... the same as any foul.

Same - same.

The thing about advancing once the ball is touched only applies "prior to catching" -- i.e. if the ball is caught eventually. Again, same as on any fly ball.

The mere call of infield fly does not anchor the runners to the base, but by removing the force, it allows them to stay on the base even if the ball is not caught.

[IRISHMAFIA]

I certainly hope this isn't a veteran umpire. If so, he needs some remedial clinics.

You've received the appropriate responses, however, I would not print them for the purpose of trying to show the umpire he is wrong. This is better coming from a rules interpreter, a State/Metro UIC or one of their deputies or assistants. The umpire is more likely to accept an explanation from those persons than from a group on the internet.

[greymule]

For some reason, many people—including those who certainly should know better—have the same or similar misconceptions about the IFR. I don't know why this rule causes so much difficulty.

I once worked with an ump who thought that runners could leave as soon the IFR was declared, as if the "catch" occurred at the moment of the out.

In a game I was watching this past summer, two of our experienced guys conferred a while and then asked me whether a runner who was off his base after an IFR pop was caught was liable to be put out on appeal. When they then properly called the runner out, the runner's team argued this seemingly obvious ruling.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by greymule
For some reason, many people—including those who certainly should know better—have the same or similar misconceptions about the IFR. I don't know why this rule causes so much difficulty.

I've said it before and apparently it is worth repeating:

The Infield Fly rule is probably the simplest rule in the book to understand. If someone cannot comprehend the IFR, they are in the wrong game.

[bethsdad]

I was playing in an adult SP game a couple years ago , the ump called infield fly. I don't remember exactly what happened but I took off for 3rd. The umpire then sent me back saying it was a dead ball. I knew it wasn't worth the arguement. Brian

[greymule]

Yes, I've seen that "automatic dead ball" call on the IFR many times.

Often after I call a batter out for IFR, somebody soon afterward hits a pop with, say, a runner on 3B and no outs. Somebody invariably wants to know why I didn't call the batter out. After all, it was an "infield fly."

[whiskers_ump]

Often after I call a batter out for IFR, somebody soon afterward hits a pop with, say, a runner on 3B and no outs. Somebody invariably wants to know why I didn't call the batter out. After all, it was an "infield fly."

True, very true greymule, I get that remark all
the time..."Blue, that's an infield fly, you called
it earlier!" "Coach, what was positioning of the
runners the first time it was called?"

glen

[SWFLguy]

No umpire worth their salt should mess up on the IF rule.
When I think it could be a factor- I always add---
"Infield fly- batter is out- IF FAIR !!!"
I have seen what was described happen,
but not often in my 45 years of umpiring.
One other aspect of this---- I also consider the level of
play when I call it--- because of the "easily caught"
part of the rule. I prefer to call it more liberally in
youth play to remove the chance of a "cheap"
double play. Calling "batter is OUT" forcefully.

[CecilOne]

Originally posted by greymule
... snip ... I once worked with an ump who thought that runners could leave as soon the IFR was declared, as if the "catch" occurred at the moment of the out.
... snip ...

Be careful not to confuse any rookies who might be reading. The moment of the out is when the ball is hit, not when it's called. The B never becomes a BR and if the lights fail after the ball is hit, the Batter is out; even if the umpire doesn't call it until the lights come back on (as long as the umpire can see long enough to judge it).

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by CecilOne

Be careful not to confuse any rookies who might be reading. The moment of the out is when the ball is hit, not when it's called. The B never becomes a BR and if the lights fail after the ball is hit, the Batter is out; even if the umpire doesn't call it until the lights come back on (as long as the umpire can see long enough to judge it).

C-One,

Grey was only relating what another uninformed umpire believed, and, speaking ASA, your assertion concerning the call is inaccurate. A Batter becomes a Batter-runner the moment they put the ball into fair play. An IF cannot be determined until the umpire can witness the flight of the ball and an infielder's ability to catch said ball with ordinary effort. Besides, the IFR state the "batter-runner" is out when....

Let's not confuse any rookies.

[Bluefoot]

The game example in the original post demonstrates why it's probably a good idea to always add "if fair" to the end of an infield fly declaration, don't you think? Or is it proper procedure to always add "if fair", even if the ball is out by 2B? Or is it left up to our judgement whether or not to add it to the call? Thanks.

[argodad]

Originally posted by Bluefoot
Or is it proper procedure to always add "if fair", even if the ball is out by 2B? Or is it left up to our judgement ...?

You can add "if fair" to an obviously fair ball if you want, but at the risk of sounding robotic, IMHO. On something anywhere close to the line it's a good idea.

I had a 12U game with an IF, easy play down the 3B line. It wasn't real high, so I yelled out, "Infield fly! Batter is out, if fair!" pretty quickly. A gust blew the ball, it hit F3's glove above foul gound and fell to the dirt. The coach yelled, "What did you say, Blue?" I said, "Foul ball."

Larry