The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Softball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Thu Mar 07, 2013, 03:17pm
Stirrer of the Pot
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Lowcountry, SC
Posts: 2,380
Headbands in FED

Quick question for those who umpire NFHS girls fast-pitch. Are plastic headbands like this one illegal?



Rule 3-2-5 covers headwear, including headbands, with a focus on colors. It doesn't provide guidance on what those headbands can be made of. It then talks of flat items like bobby pins and hair clips, limiting them to two inches in length. It finishes by stating that plastic visors, bandannas, and hair-beads are illegal.

We had a varsity pitcher in a scrimmage game a couple of days ago, and she wore a plastic headband similar to the one above. One umpire I was evaluating argued that if plastic visors are illegal, so should plastic headbands. I don't think that's the case, but I'm not sure.
__________________
"Let's face it. Umpiring is not an easy or happy way to make a living. In the abuse they suffer, and the pay they get for it, you see an imbalance that can only be explained by their need to stay close to a game they can't resist." -- Bob Uecker
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Thu Mar 07, 2013, 03:58pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 8,033
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manny A View Post
Quick question for those who umpire NFHS girls fast-pitch. Are plastic headbands like this one illegal?


if plastic visors are illegal, so should plastic headbands.
Hate people that use this kind of logic. There should be no SHOULD in this. If something's illegal, it's illegal. If something else is not proscribed as illegal, it's not illegal. We are not in the simile business.
__________________
I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'”

West Houston Mike
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Thu Mar 07, 2013, 04:05pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,340
3-2-5 Flat items no longer than 2".............

That is neither flat, nor 2" and under.
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Thu Mar 07, 2013, 04:58pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 8,033
Quote:
Originally Posted by RKBUmp View Post
3-2-5 Flat items no longer than 2".............

That is neither flat, nor 2" and under.
And yet, one is in the middle picture of the 3 examples that came with the Rule Corrections ... and under that is the word, "LEGAL".
__________________
I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'”

West Houston Mike
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Thu Mar 07, 2013, 05:05pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,340
Where was that published? Have not seen it and was not in this years preseason handout.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Thu Mar 07, 2013, 05:47pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 8,033
Quote:
Originally Posted by RKBUmp View Post
Where was that published? Have not seen it and was not in this years preseason handout.
I'll try to find it on line... or I'll scan it and post if possible. Came from the second clinic I went to where we went over rule changes.
__________________
I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'”

West Houston Mike
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Thu Mar 07, 2013, 06:01pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,340
I guess "flat" depends on which direction you are talking. It may be flat front to rear, but it certainly is not flat side to side. It also is far longer than 2", so would be interesting to hear their reasoning behind considering it legal.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Thu Mar 07, 2013, 08:52pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Posts: 1,640
This was touched on last year in the 2012 Preseason Guide. There is an illustration there which might be the one MD is thinking of. But of the three pictures shown (those black sillouette pict-o-gram looking things) it doesn't seem to be showing the type of headband in Manny's post.

I don't have a scanner available to post this. The article in the guide seems more concerned with the color of the headbands/caps/visors/ribbons, since that was part of the rule changes last year.

As far as material, it does say this: Plastic visors, bandanas and hair-beads are prohibited.

Absent a more definitive ruling, in my judgment this would fall under the rules covering "hair control devices". Since it is neither flat nor less than 2 inches, it would be prohibited.

Last edited by BretMan; Thu Mar 07, 2013 at 08:54pm.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Fri Mar 08, 2013, 08:14am
Stirrer of the Pot
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Lowcountry, SC
Posts: 2,380
Quote:
Originally Posted by RKBUmp View Post
3-2-5 Flat items no longer than 2".............

That is neither flat, nor 2" and under.
So a plastic barrette that is 3" long is illegal, and the headband I posted is not?? I'm confused by your post.
__________________
"Let's face it. Umpiring is not an easy or happy way to make a living. In the abuse they suffer, and the pay they get for it, you see an imbalance that can only be explained by their need to stay close to a game they can't resist." -- Bob Uecker
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Fri Mar 08, 2013, 09:27am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,340
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manny A View Post
So a plastic barrette that is 3" long is illegal, and the headband I posted is not?? I'm confused by your post.
My comment about it is neither flat nor 2" or under was to indicate I would believe it to be illegal. It is not flat, and it is longer than 2" and does not fit within the description defined in the rule.
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Fri Mar 08, 2013, 09:42am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 962
Not sure how but I exceed the post limits...but I think the picture that was referenced is out of last years rule meeting. And to me it appears to be a different soft type of material. The guideline I have always heard, except for bobby pins that have to meet the 2" requirement, if you can't tie it in a knot you can't wear it in your hair. So the OP is hard plastic it is NOT legal.
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Fri Mar 08, 2013, 09:58am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: The Land Of The Free and The Home Of The Brave (MD/DE)
Posts: 6,425
Obviously over 2 inches, so no question.

Also, anything with a knot is illegal, apparently except pre-wrap (tiny soft knot).
__________________
Officiating takes more than OJT.
It's not our jobs to invent rulings to fit our personal idea of what should and should not be.
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Fri Mar 08, 2013, 10:13am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 962
Quote:
Originally Posted by CecilOne View Post
Also, anything with a knot is illegal, apparently except pre-wrap (tiny soft knot).
My comment (if you can tie it in a knot) was more to speak to the flexibililty of the item, not that it would be legal if worn with a knot in it.
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Fri Mar 08, 2013, 10:38am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: The Land Of The Free and The Home Of The Brave (MD/DE)
Posts: 6,425
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveASA/FED View Post
My comment (if you can tie it in a knot) was more to speak to the flexibililty of the item, not that it would be legal if worn with a knot in it.
I thought so, just completing the universe.
__________________
Officiating takes more than OJT.
It's not our jobs to invent rulings to fit our personal idea of what should and should not be.
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Fri Mar 08, 2013, 11:27am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 8,033
Quote:
Originally Posted by BretMan View Post
This was touched on last year in the 2012 Preseason Guide. There is an illustration there which might be the one MD is thinking of. But of the three pictures shown (those black sillouette pict-o-gram looking things) it doesn't seem to be showing the type of headband in Manny's post.

I don't have a scanner available to post this. The article in the guide seems more concerned with the color of the headbands/caps/visors/ribbons, since that was part of the rule changes last year.

As far as material, it does say this: Plastic visors, bandanas and hair-beads are prohibited.

Absent a more definitive ruling, in my judgment this would fall under the rules covering "hair control devices". Since it is neither flat nor less than 2 inches, it would be prohibited.
That's it. Same one. The middle picture is definitely thinner than the one posted in the OP... but the device in the middle picture is definitely longer than 2 inches, and is definitely a hair control device (and actually extends FURTHER than the one in the OP).

I think we can agree the one shown in the OP is not a plastic visor, is not a bandana, and is not a hair bead.
__________________
I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'”

West Houston Mike
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Headbands Zoochy Basketball 13 Tue Dec 09, 2008 11:54pm
Headbands at BC Scrapper1 Basketball 1 Sun Feb 18, 2007 08:50am
Headbands Oklahoma official Basketball 13 Thu Nov 10, 2005 04:09am
headbands Ron Pilo Basketball 4 Thu Dec 19, 2002 04:23pm
Headbands RookieDude Basketball 29 Thu Dec 19, 2002 12:20am


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:16am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1