june carifications

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally Posted by LIUmp

In which instances is the batter what is scheduled to bat last in the inning different from the "last batted out"? I have umpires in my organization who explain to the coaches that last batted out should go to second base. I tell them it's not last batted out, it's player scheduled to bat last in the inning. They say "same difference". I cringe.

How do I effectively explain the difference to these numbskulls?

One of many examples.

B1 put out, B2 put out. B3 walks. B4 walks. B5 walks. With B6 at bat, any one of the 3 runners is picked off, or R3 out at plate attempting to advance on passed ball.

By the rule, B6 is first batter in next inning, B5 placed on base. "Last batted out" (a term that doesn't exist) was B2; clearly the wrong runner.

Or, just about any play that is a fielder's choice for the 3rd out, or any advance runner thrown out; the last batter wasn't put out, so wouldn't be the runner by those claiming "same difference".

[CecilOne]

That is why one rule book says "last completed turn at bat".

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

One of many examples.

B1 put out, B2 put out. B3 walks. B4 walks. B5 walks. With B6 at bat, any one of the 3 runners is picked off, or R3 out at plate attempting to advance on passed ball.

By the rule, B6 is first batter in next inning, B5 placed on base. "Last batted out" (a term that doesn't exist) was B2; clearly the wrong runner.

Or, just about any play that is a fielder's choice for the 3rd out, or any advance runner thrown out; the last batter wasn't put out, so wouldn't be the runner by those claiming "same difference".

Here is how I explain it.

Pull out your well-maintained line up card and locate the batter scheduled to lead off that half an inning. Now, look at the name of the player in the batting order slot immediately above. That player, or legal substitute or legal courtesy runner, it the player placed on 2nd base to start the inning.

[LIUmp]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Here is how I explain it.

Pull out your well-maintained line up card and locate the batter scheduled to lead off that half an inning. Now, look at the name of the player in the batting order slot immediately above. That player, or legal substitute or legal courtesy runner, it the player placed on 2nd base to start the inning.

Can you place a courtesy runner on 2nd for the start of that inning, considering the F1 or F2 didn't technically bat to earn their way on 2nd?

[EsqUmp]

Originally Posted by LIUmp

Can you place a courtesy runner on 2nd for the start of that inning, considering the F1 or F2 didn't technically bat to earn their way on 2nd?

Yes. There is no prohibition against it - ASA, PONY, NYSSO

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally Posted by LIUmp

Can you place a courtesy runner on 2nd for the start of that inning, considering the F1 or F2 didn't technically bat to earn their way on 2nd?

How does ANY player technically earn their way to 2nd as the tiebreaker runner?

Answer: By being the player listed in the batting order directly above the proper first batter (aka the 9th listed batter in the inning).

Does the player's defensive position change that? Did the F3, F4, etc., do anything additional to EARN that position? Assuming you answer correctly, then you should understand that F1 and F2 did everything every OTHER player did to EARN that position.

Yes, they EARNED that position, just like every OTHER player in the listed lineup, and as F1 or F2 that played that defensive position at the end of the prior half inning, then they are eligible for courtesy runners.

[LIUmp]

ok...I figured I'd play devil's advocate and ask.