Home Plate Collision

[Coachtindell]

I am going to try to describe this in such a way that I don't appear biased and see if I can get a reasonable answer, so bare with me.

10U ASA rules.

Runner on 1st and 2nd, and ball is hit to right field. Runner at second rounds 3rd headed for home. Catcher standing in front of plate between home plate and pitcher awaiting a throw. She is in such a position as that the back half of her body is obstructing the plate.

Throw coming in from right is cut off by 1st baseman about 20 feet from plate, negating the play at home. Runner collides with Catcher standing up. Runner does not fall, but catcher is knocked down.

The runner did not intentionally or maliciously run in to her. What is the call?

[Dakota]

so bare with me

I have too much decorum for that. I will bear with you, however! (ok, pardon my wise acre nature...)

Obstruction, warning to the catcher to get out of the way of the runners, runner safe, suggestion to runner's coach that his players slide.

Uhhh, upon further review, suggestion that his runners avoid contact when possible

[Edited by Dakota on Jun 25th, 2003 at 03:11 PM]

[IHSAIllini]

I'm thinking HTBT on this one, but I'll offer up my opinion based on the facts as you've presented them. This smells of obstruction by the fielder because of the cutoff. Since the fielder was not in the act of receiving or about to immediately receive the ball, they had no business being in front of the plate.

That said, the runner's stupid for not sliding, or otherwise attempting to avoid contact. Stupid, but protected by the rules.

Of course, I could be wrong - but I don't think so. (If I am, oh well.)

[Edited by IHSAIllini on Jun 25th, 2003 at 03:05 PM]

[DaveASA/FED]

This is a Had To Be There (HTBT) call. The ASA rule states that a runner is out if they remain standing and crash into a fielder (what is your def. of crash?) with the ball or about to receive the ball. Neither is you case. It also has a section about unsportmanlike conduct that can eject the player, maybe but an absolute HTBT. Was the runner running with her head down and she nudged the catcher and that made her fall, did she drop a shoulder and take her out? Also did the fielder move, even though the throw was cut did she move where the ball would have gone and by moving may have helped cause the impact? These are things that we have to look at in a split second. In your post you mention that she was blocking 1/2 the plate, granted runner is entitled to basepath and base if fielder does not have or is about to receive the ball but, couldn't the runner have hit the back side of plate and avoided impact? These are all details we need to make a judgement, and again we really have to see them but taking you for you word "The runner did not intentionally or maliciously run in to her." I would have a no call.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by Dakota

I have too much decorum for that. I will bear with you, however! (ok, pardon my wise acre nature...)

Obstruction, warning to the catcher to get out of the way of the runners, runner safe, suggestion to runner's coach that his players slide.

Tom,

I know you don't mean that. There is no way you suggest a coach tell their players to slide as that puts you in the litigation path. But absent of intent or malice, obstruction seems to be a reasonable call if it actually kept the runner from contacting the plate. If a player slides and sweeps the catcher's legs, that could be considered malicious and USC if, in the umpire's judgment, it was not necessary.

Other than that, an explanation to the catcher's coach as to why it might not be wise to stand in certain places.

[Dakota]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA

Tom,

I know you don't mean that.

Ummm, I mean, ... (see corrected post)

[whiskers_ump]

I stand by my originial post except for underlinned portion,
which I am now sure of.

First off, F2 is blocking plate without the ball. [Obstruction]

Second HTBT, but you stated PU said that act was
unintentional. Runner does not have to slide,
however, should avoid contact if possible. Without
seeing the play and judging by what you stated
PU saw no intentional collision.

ASA Rule 8 Sec 7 Q states:

When a defensive player has the ball, [Not your case],
or is about to catch a thrown ball, [again not your case],
and the runner remains upright and craches into the
defensive player the runner is out. If the act is
determined to be flagrant, offender shall be ejected.

This is a HTBT situtation, but as described I am sure
I would have not called the runner out.
JMHO
glen

And thanks for all the backing Tom...I agree with your statement
of why PU sent coach to dugout....probably trying to keep him in
the game.

glen

BTW Coach Atindell, Welcome to the board....

[Coachtindell]

Thank you for the very clear presentation. I will tell you (even though some of you know) I was the coach of the catcher.

It wasn't a malicious attack, although she did knock her several feet on impact, but her head was not down she didn't lower a shoulder and she didn't alter her line.

My bad, on the appeal. I read the rule wrong previously. I will come here for advice from now on though. I posted this on eteamz and the responses were unclear and people very sensitive and got off the subject very quickly.

He probably was saving me from being booted, he said he didn't hear the other coach harp at me, and would have acted differently if he had. Field umpire a great guy and will have to tell the kid behind the plate that he handled the call and the situation very well.

Local league play though and she made a fool of herself by acting without class, so others will remember. What comes around goes around.