Interference Question

[MNBlue]

Originally Posted by Steve M

Interesting that ther is no late/current reponse from our original poster - nsc_wa - if I remember correctly.

Perhaps one of our members took the discussion with nsc_wa offline so he could ask questions without feeling embarrassed. Or maybe he took Sean's advice and found someone local to help.

Just a thought.

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by Steve M

Interesting that ther is no late/current reponse from our original poster - nsc_wa - if I remember correctly.
From folks I know, I can tell you Mike is not a friendly teacher - but he is a very good teacher. He is thorough.
From those who whine that he and others are too harsh, they have not hear me ask what do they rule book and manual say? My frequent suggestion is to RTFM - translation is - Read The F-ing Manual.
After one has does that - RTFM - I will gladly answer/address any question that remains.

Mikey thinks he is teflon. Talk to him in the same manner he talks to others, and his defense mechanism meter goes off the charts. I've seen him, and others go off on a new poster for asking questions on the baseball forum. They then label such poster a troll. The baseball forum became a joke to me because bob jenkins allowed it to become one.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by Steven Tyler

Mikey thinks he is teflon. Talk to him in the same manner he talks to others, and his defense mechanism meter goes off the charts. I've seen him, and others go off on a new poster for asking questions on the baseball forum. They then label such poster a troll. The baseball forum became a joke to me because bob jenkins allowed it to become one.

You and mbcrowder have had an ongoing, seemingly personal, dispute on the baseball board. Please keep it there.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by umpire12

"No argument, but that was not the case here. The newb was given the answers and then told where to find them"

actually, no...he was given the wrong answer. he asked which section of rule 8 would satisy his interference question. he was told 'the interference section'. we all know there is no 'interference' section in rule 8. how frustrating it must be to be told by a verteran umpire that the answer could be found in the ' interference' section of rule 8 only to find there is no such section. also i , like nsc wa and others found the initial response to be more of an attempt to give his cronies a giggle more than to actually to help and support him. it was embarrassing to read it . yes, debasing is a good word for it. its an all too common occurance on this site

Maybe I was thinking of the 6 other test questions asked. But in that case, ncs_wa offered and answer and that was addresses. And as I pointed out, there is an interference that references rule 8. Yeah, it's not in rule 8, but the book is more than a rule number.

Mike's response was a teaching point. Maybe some believe the tests should just be published with the answers and assume the participants will actually take the time to look them up. I've been doing this too long to know that is not happening with the majority of the umpires, including veterans.

Personally, I think it is a damn shame that this umpire isn't or wasn't being given the time of day by his own association, assuming his account is accurate and there is no reason to believe it is not. I'll give him credit for trying to find the answers, but is this really the place it should be?

I remember when we used to have folks on McGriffs that tried to poach test results simply because some were too lazy to do the work. Is that the guy/gal you want as a partner in a game?

If nsc_wa keeps it up, there shouldn't be a question as to being a knowledgeable umpire, but there is a need to learn how to do it, not just get the right answers on a test.

[rwest]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

I'll give him credit for trying to find the answers, but is this really the place it should be?

Absolutely it should be! Without a doubt! I have been umpiring for 9 years now. I know there are those who have more experience then I. I just mentioned that to indicate I'm no rookie. However, 9 years ago I joined this site and I'm glad I did. I learned a lot on this site. I used it more heavily than I do now. If he can't come here to learn where should he go? Yes, his association should be teaching him, but this is a secondary learning tool! In some cases it is easier to come here and post a question than it is to call someone in the umpires association. You get more for your trouble. You can get multiple responses with just one question. There's great dialogue. Sure at times it digresses into a pissing match, unfortunately. But for the most part it is good debate.

One thing we veterans need to remember is how it was when we first started. Some veterans here can be a little too dismissive of the rookies in my opinion.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by rwest

Absolutely it should be! Without a doubt! I have been umpiring for 9 years now. I know there are those who have more experience then I. I just mentioned that to indicate I'm no rookie. However, 9 years ago I joined this site and I'm glad I did. I learned a lot on this site. I used it more heavily than I do now. If he can't come here to learn where should he go? Yes, his association should be teaching him, but this is a secondary learning tool! In some cases it is easier to come here and post a question than it is to call someone in the umpires association. You get more for your trouble. You can get multiple responses with just one question. There's great dialogue. Sure at times it digresses into a pissing match, unfortunately. But for the most part it is good debate.

One thing we veterans need to remember is how it was when we first started. Some veterans here can be a little too dismissive of the rookies in my opinion.

I didn't say it couldn't be helpful. For that matter, it is priceless to some. However, this or any other discussion board should not be considered a primary resource to reference.

Do you accept an argument from a coach when he tells you he knows the rule because he checked at Heybucket.com?

Would you expect a clinician to accept this or any other board when addressing a rule or interpretation at a clinic or on the field?

One of the quickest ways for an umpire to kill his/her rules knowledge credibility with a UIC is to start the explanation of a call with, "Well, at home....." or "On the game on TV the other night..." Had a guy reference what was done "at home" in OKC one time, and I think they heard the UIC in the guy's home state (CA).

You talk about how valuable this is and how much you learned here, yet when people are trying to prod a newbie into researching and discovering the rules, you chastise them. Did everyone just give you test answers when you first joined? I'm pretty sure that wasn't the case.

Look, this and other boards can be a great source of information. Between here, McGriffs and other umpiring sites, we've had some great discussions, arguments and even discoveries that led to rule changes and interpretations. However, these boards are not a substitute for a school, clinic, seminar or study session. One may learn some of the mechanics, some of the rules and interpretations, but someone isn't going to become an umpire from coming to websites to learn.

[Steve M]

Originally Posted by rwest

...
One thing we veterans need to remember is how it was when we first started. Some veterans here can be a little too dismissive of the rookies in my opinion.

Perhaps the rookie appears to be arguing - not appropriate.
Perhaps the rookie appears to looking for an answer that would best be understood by finding it in the rule book.

Once I decided to get a bit more serious about umpiring, I kept a log or umpire diary. For "strange" situations, I'd note what my ruling had been, I'd note what the rule book said - after I'd looked it up - and I'd note what a few clinicians or more skilled umpires said. It's a great way to ensure the same mistake is not made twice. Do your homework first, then ask for clarification.

[ronald]

+1 on the troll.

[Andy]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

....One may learn some of the mechanics, some of the rules and interpretations, but someone isn't going to become an umpire from coming to websites to learn.

But we can certainly recommend good beer......