Improper Appeal - how to call it

[WestMichiganBlue]

R1 on 1B, goes to 2B on fly ball. F4 calls for ball, tags 2B and appeals to you that R1 left 1B early. What's your call?

You can not call R1 out because she wasn't tagged nor was 1B tagged. If you signal safe, then you are telling F4 "no, she did not leave early" and she will give up and return the ball to F1. If you make no signal and say "improper appeal" then you are coaching F4, and she may eventually figure it out and run over and tag R1. Now if you call R1 out, will you expect an earfull from the offensive coach claiming that you are helping the defense?

WMB

[Tap]

I hope I'm not misreading this.

In ASA, verbal appeals from infielders are recognized when the ball is dead. There is no need to tag the runner or 1B.

After 2B was tagged, I would make no signal. I would then call "time" (if I had not done so already). If any infielder states that she left 1B early, I've got my appeal and an out.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by WestMichiganBlue
R1 on 1B, goes to 2B on fly ball. F4 calls for ball, tags 2B and appeals to you that R1 left 1B early. What's your call?

You can not call R1 out because she wasn't tagged nor was 1B tagged. If you signal safe, then you are telling F4 "no, she did not leave early" and she will give up and return the ball to F1. If you make no signal and say "improper appeal" then you are coaching F4, and she may eventually figure it out and run over and tag R1. Now if you call R1 out, will you expect an earfull from the offensive coach claiming that you are helping the defense?

WMB

My call is "SAFE". The umpire is merely responding to the player's action and request.

Depending on the game (FP/SP) I will respectively allow play to continue (get the ball to the circle) or kill the ball if it is apparent the runner isn't going anywhere.

However, once I kill the ball (I'm sure the plate will need to be cleaned at this point ) and there's no obvious movement by R1 to return to 1B, I will now honor a dead ball appeal, if offered.

[SamNVa]

I figure to get some complaints on this method, but I would respond "Safe" fully expecting to hear "Time Blue! What do you mean Safe, ir was obcious that she left early" Thsi works especially well in FED where the coach is allowed to make a dead ball appeal. In ASa, I'd probably have to turn to F4 and ask, "Who is he talking about?" or simply say quietly to the coach, "I saw it too, but without a proper appeal, I can't call ehr out" and leave it to him to figure out how to appeal properly.

JMO,
SamC

[CecilOne]

Originally posted by SamNVa
I figure to get some complaints on this method, but I would respond "Safe" fully expecting to hear "Time Blue! What do you mean Safe, ir was obcious that she left early" Thsi works especially well in FED where the coach is allowed to make a dead ball appeal. In ASa, I'd probably have to turn to F4 and ask, "Who is he talking about?" or simply say quietly to the coach, "I saw it too, but without a proper appeal, I can't call ehr out" and leave it to him to figure out how to appeal properly.
JMO,
SamC

I would never say "I saw it too, but without a proper appeal, I can't call ehr out", especially "I saw it too".
But I agree that if the ball is still live, you have to signal safe on the improper appeal, just as you would on any failed attempt to get an out. On a dead ball, if the fielder (F4 in this case) says she left early, any nearby runner I saw leave early gets called out (unless the fielder is obviously referring to the wrong runner, like by tagging her).

[Striker991]

This has come up several times, even in my short time as an umpire. The way I handle it is no call, then say to the coach, if approached, "if you want to appeal, you must do it properly." This wouldn't be coaching, because you aren't telling him how to do it. I agree with CecilOne. Never, ever say what you saw until an appeal is made. This provides advantage. The coach must make a decision to appeal if he wants the out. I also agree with WestMichiganBlue that calling Safe is inappropriate because a proper appeal has not been made. This would mislead the fielder and give advantage to the offense. Believe me, I WANT outs. But as an umpire, I must remain impartial and not give coaching advice during a game I am officiating.