Postponed game problem.

[CajunNewBlue]

NCAA Game.
PU takes lineup's, makes them official and finishes plate meeting... during the home team pitcher's warmup, lightning strikes....so into the dugouts everyone goes and the countdown timer starts. before the 30 minutes is up, a deluge of rain hits the field and the game(s) is pushed back to Sunday.

Sunday comes and per conference rules we must do the game(s) from Saturday..... plate meeting reoccurs... home team coach comes up with a completely different lineup!!

Is a resubmittal of a different/modified lineup for the same game to be allowed at all or does allowing it count toward substitutions?
The line-ups were made official at the plate meeting on saturday... yet the game was never started.

Play ball was never verbalized or signaled... per NCAA 6.3 (pg71)

This is a hypothetical scenario discussed between this umpire and another umpire who dont mind our names being mentioned.... but i wont. (just kidding topper..... cya this weekend. )

[NCASAUmp]

Not sure about NCAA, but in ASA, once those line-ups are accepted by the plate umpire, that's it. That's the line-up. A TD may make an exception, but by rule, they don't have to.

That's my $.02.

[IRISHMAFIA]

From Rule 6 of the NCAA book, Starting the Game:

SECTION 3. The game begins when the plate umpire calls or signals,

“ Play/Play ball.” The game shall start on time unless the home team gives

previous notice that the game has been postponed or will be delayed in

s t a r t i n g .

IMO, and this is pure opinion, if the game did not start, it cannot be suspended by the umpire. Therefore, unless the PU started the game as per the rule above, it never existed, start from scratch the following day.

I could be wrong, but that's how I would look at it.

[CajunNewBlue]

Well during the discussion tween myself and the other unnamed umpire.... the lineups were taken... reviewed and made official verbally... coaches were then asked if they had any changes to make at "this time" both declined..... but "play ball" was never signaled or verbalized..... so did the "postponement" of the game make them unofficial overnight?
(i contend that it cannot be a suspended game because the game never officially started...nor can it be a halted game.... so it must be a postponed game.)

Are they (the lineups) any less official due to the time frame than if the home coach came out during the pitchers warm-up and said "ooops blue, i gave you the wrong lineup!!"

[youngump]

Originally Posted by CajunNewBlue

Well during the discussion tween myself and the other unnamed umpire.... the lineups were taken... reviewed and made official verbally... coaches were then asked if they had any changes to make at "this time" both declined..... but "play ball" was never signaled or verbalized..... so did the "postponement" of the game make them unofficial overnight?
(i contend that it cannot be a suspended game because the game never officially started...nor can it be a halted game.... so it must be a postponed game.)

It's a reschedule game. No?
________
NylonsGoddess live

[CajunNewBlue]

rescheduled might be the correct term.....hrmmmm

[Dutch Alex]

Since we don't have these problems over here in the Netherlands; we never play the rest out, simply start all over...
However let me try to come to any common sense about the problem by answering the obvious questions.
1) What do you do if the rain starts right after plate conference and PlayBall sounds before 30 minutes are gone?
1> I think you never accept a new line-up. You only had to wait 30 minutes...

2) What do in a "normal" situation? Game is suspended after 3 innings playing until the next day.
2> I understand that you will not accept a new line-up! That's the rule, isn't it?

3) What occurs if a suspended game is rescheduled to next weekend?
3> I think you would accept in this case a new line-up.

Conclusion or my Euro0,02:
Since there's only 24 hours between the two plate conferences you might think that both teams can show up in the same line up. I've noticed that is the normal procedure. So why would you accept a new line-up?

The problem we're facing have I (stupid) discussed at the dinner table. My wife is sure that the real question is; has the game started just by the plate conference? She saw the NCAA-rule, stating that PlayBall must be called. So she and I aren't in the same corner (again)...
Please let there be one answer coming soon, the who is right or wrong is again in our home!

[SRW]

Let's assume for a minute that you started playing the same day after the 30 minutes were up, and the game was not postponed until Sunday. Would you accept a new lineup at that point? Why the issue with 30 minutes vs. 24 hours?

I dunno. Personally, I'd probably allow the new lineup. Not sure that by rule I should, but practicality, survivablity and common sense tells me otherwise.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Dutch Alex

However let me try to come to any common sense about the problem by answering the obvious questions.

1) What do you do if the rain starts right after plate conference and PlayBall sounds before 30 minutes are gone?
1> I think you never accept a new line-up. You only had to wait 30 minutes...

2) What do in a "normal" situation? Game is suspended after 3 innings playing until the next day.
2> I understand that you will not accept a new line-up! That's the rule, isn't it?

3) What occurs if a suspended game is rescheduled to next weekend?
3> I think you would accept in this case a new line-up.

Conclusion or my Euro0,02:
Since there's only 24 hours between the two plate conferences you might think that both teams can show up in the same line up. I've noticed that is the normal procedure. So why would you accept a new line-up?

The problem we're facing have I (stupid) discussed at the dinner table. My wife is sure that the real question is; has the game started just by the plate conference? She saw the NCAA-rule, stating that PlayBall must be called. So she and I aren't in the same corner (again)...
Please let there be one answer coming soon, the who is right or wrong is again in our home!

Well, you are lucky, but this is an ISF rule which specifically notes that when starting over, and original line ups may be changed.

Meanwhile, for NCAA:

1) But the umpire has no authority concerning the weather and field until the game starts which, as noted, it had not.

2 & 3) Game has already started, so the umpire can suspend the game, therefore, it is the same game.

I'm with your wife on this one.

[HugoTafurst]

Originally Posted by Dutch Alex

Since we don't have these problems over here in the Netherlands; we never play the rest out, simply start all over...
However let me try to come to any common sense about the problem by answering the obvious questions.
1) What do you do if the rain starts right after plate conference and PlayBall sounds before 30 minutes are gone?
1> I think you never accept a new line-up. You only had to wait 30 minutes...

2) What do in a "normal" situation? Game is suspended after 3 innings playing until the next day.
2> I understand that you will not accept a new line-up! That's the rule, isn't it?

3) What occurs if a suspended game is rescheduled to next weekend?
3> I think you would accept in this case a new line-up.

Conclusion or my Euro0,02:
Since there's only 24 hours between the two plate conferences you might think that both teams can show up in the same line up. I've noticed that is the normal procedure. So why would you accept a new line-up?

The problem we're facing have I (stupid) discussed at the dinner table. My wife is sure that the real question is; has the game started just by the plate conference? She saw the NCAA-rule, stating that PlayBall must be called. So she and I aren't in the same corner (again)...
Please let there be one answer coming soon, the who is right or wrong is again in our home!

Dutch - I hope this doesn't ruin your sex life!!

[SergioJ]

Okay, my two pesos worth. Oh wait; my twenty-two pesos worth.

The only mention in the NCAA rule book of the lineups having to be identical to when play was suspended is in Rule 6.17, Halted Game. Since the halted game rule was not in effect (it has to be determined at the pregame meeting), then you are basically left with a NO GAME (6.18). So, in my opinion, this is the same as a rescheduled game. New lineups to be given at pregame meeting.

Again, just my forty-four pesos worth.

Serg

[Skahtboi]

Mine as well sound off with my two rubles.

The game had not officially started. Therefore, the line-ups are irrelevant if the game is not played. I would accept whatever line-up was presented on Sunday.

[Dutch Alex]

Originally Posted by HugoTafurst

Dutch - I hope this doesn't ruin your sex life!!

Well as long as Irish stays on your side of the ocean AND my wife stays in Europe what can go wrong?

I'm glad you guys finally made up your mind, sort of, according the need for new line-ups. I think I go out to buy some fresh flowers for the lady and drive the who-is-right-and-who-ain't troubles out. Than maybe on a Friday-soon-to come I might get lucky (again)