licking fingers

[Tru_in_Blu]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Do you think it is an advantage for a player to be able to get a good grip on the ball?

Well I have a couple of questions?

1) Pitching clinics for girls aged 10 to 14 years old will quickly introduce the concept of:
a) the grip
b) identifying the batter's weaknesses
c) the physics of pitching a softball
d) how to leap without being noticed

2) It is an advantage for a player to be able to get a grip on:
a) the ball
b) the bat
c) OOO umpires
d) all of the above

Ted

[Crabby_Bob]

A softball is less dense than a baseball thus, is more susceptible to aerodynamic forces. From a doctoring viewpoint, the object is not to add a great mass of goop to the ball, but to alter the boundary layer of air flowing over the ball, in particular by changing the smoothness over a region. A gross example of this can be seen in the curveball trainers found in sporting goods stores. Much less dense than a baseball (same size though) and it has a series of grooves over half the surface.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Crabby_Bob

A softball is less dense than a baseball thus, is more susceptible to aerodynamic forces. From a doctoring viewpoint, the object is not to add a great mass of goop to the ball, but to alter the boundary layer of air flowing over the ball, in particular by changing the smoothness over a region. A gross example of this can be seen in the curveball trainers found in sporting goods stores. Much less dense than a baseball (same size though) and it has a series of grooves over half the surface.

While noted as a point of the foreign substance issue, I do not believe it is the point here. Talking about moistening a particular spot on the ball to make that side heavier through the absorption of saliva.

However, you also must take into consideration the distance and speed as to the affect it would have on the ball.

Back to the point. Simply dampening one's fingers is not going to affect the ball's path to the plate.

[Dakota]

Mike,

Other than your well known ability to play mind games, you're not one to misstate the obvious, especially several times in one thread.

Makes me wonder about the "advantage" thing. The best I could come up with is since it is obviously an advantange to be able to grip the ball, compared with the absurdity of not being able to grip the ball, you were using the word in the rules sense of "illegal advantage." Or, you could just be playing mind games. Or, both.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Dakota

Mike,

Other than your well known ability to play mind games, you're not one to misstate the obvious, especially several times in one thread.

Makes me wonder about the "advantage" thing. The best I could come up with is since it is obviously an advantange to be able to grip the ball, compared with the absurdity of not being able to grip the ball, you were using the word in the rules sense of "illegal advantage." Or, you could just be playing mind games. Or, both.

Tom,

My point is that when a pitcher wets here fingers, it is to add moisture to the skin, not the ball. The moisture, if any at all, which may transfer to the ball will be minimal and not enough to be aborbed into the cover let alone affect the balls flight.

As has been pointed out, this is a game played in the dirt which does cause a ball and player's hands to become dusty and dry. The reason players, not just pitchers, lick their fingers is to avoid the dry, dust-covered ball from slipping out of the dry, dust-covered hands of the player. IOW, it helps the player to properly control (grip) the ball. None of my comments stated or insinuated that there was an additional, unfair or "illegal" advantage to securing a grip on the ball.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by Crabby_Bob

A softball is less dense than a baseball thus, is more susceptible to aerodynamic forces. From a doctoring viewpoint, the object is not to add a great mass of goop to the ball, but to alter the boundary layer of air flowing over the ball, in particular by changing the smoothness over a region. A gross example of this can be seen in the curveball trainers found in sporting goods stores. Much less dense than a baseball (same size though) and it has a series of grooves over half the surface.

Here's the thing... compared with a baseball, a softball has greater mass and travels a shorter distance. The aerodynamic forces would, therefore, have to be greater to influence the linear momentum of the ball (product of velocity and mass) quickly enough to have any material effect. It is possible to doctor a softball to cause this, but simple saliva won't cut it. And, as Mike pointed out, compared with the mass of the softball, the saliva has no shot at unbalancing the ball, either.

It is a stupid rule.

[shipwreck]

I agree, stupid rule. If the pitcher wets their fingers to be able to grip the ball better, to be able to control it better, but must wipe off, why not make spitting on your hands before you grip the bat illegal also? They should have to wipe off also. They are doing THAT to be able to grip the bat better and have more control with it. Dave

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by shipwreck

I agree, stupid rule. If the pitcher wets their fingers to be able to grip the ball better, to be able to control it better, but must wipe off, why not make spitting on your hands before you grip the bat illegal also? They should have to wipe off also. They are doing THAT to be able to grip the bat better and have more control with it. Dave

Here and I thought they did that to discourage the ODB from using the batter's expensive bat!

[Tru_in_Blu]

Originally Posted by Dakota

Here's the thing... compared with a baseball, a softball has greater mass and travels a shorter distance. The aerodynamic forces would, therefore, have to be greater to influence the linear momentum of the ball (product of velocity and mass) quickly enough to have any material effect. It is possible to doctor a softball to cause this, but simple saliva won't cut it. And, as Mike pointed out, compared with the mass of the softball, the saliva has no shot at unbalancing the ball, either.

I thought the greater mass, hence more stitches and surface are what helped in the ball movement, provided the pitcher imparted enough spin and maximized the number of seams catching air. I played ball with a lefty that could throw a flat curveball that broke 12 to 15 inches. You could hear the ball hissing from the spin he was able to impart on the ball.

Ted

[Dakota]

Consider a ball pitched without spin in a straight line. It will have linear momentum equal to its mass times its velocity moving in that straight line. If a force (such as aerodynamic forces generated by spin breaking up surface tension or creating aerodynamic "lift" so to speak on one direction or another) is to influence this straight-line momentum, it will need to generate enough force to cause a change in the direction of the flight of the ball, and it has only about 35 or so feet and .2 seconds to accomplish this. Other than allowing the pitcher to get a better grip on the ball (and hence impart more spin, etc.) the change in aerodynamic force from a little saliva has no shot.