State and/or National Tournaments

[Tru_in_Blu]

Howdy,

I'm a relative noobie at umpiring, going into my 4th ASA year and 1st NFHS year. I followed this board for a few months now. One thing that piques my interest is the talk about various tournaments.

I come from New England, so clearly we have a shorter overall season than some parts of the country. We do have some state tournaments for various slow pitch divisions and JO levels and fewer for men's & women's fast/modified pitch.

Some of these tournaments, while in the state that I reside, are a long distance away. Some might be an hour's drive one way, some a couple of hour's drive.

I'm trying to find out about some of the logistics of doing a state tournament. Since I haven't done that yet, national is currently out of the question for me, but perhaps others are interested in knowing more. I was invited to do 2 games at a JO state tournament last year which would have meant about 3 1/2 hours driving round trip. This is when the price of gas was around $4/gal. I also had a commitment to another game the same day, and decided to honor that commitment rather than bolt for the limelight.

There are a lot of people in this forum who've done games at all levels, serve as UICs. I've seen discussions on umpire evaluations, but as far as I know, I've not been personally evaluated - at least not with any feedback pro or con.

So I'm wondering about the "how to" and other questions. I'll note a few, but maybe don't even know enough about the whole process to ask the right questions. Thanx for any inputs, and if I ask a foolish question, have a chuckle, but please still answer it.

Thanx.

• Do you get paid for games and if so, how much?
• Are games 2, 3, or 4 person umpire mechanics?
• Are there mileage reimbursements for umpires who travel long distances?
• If you're going to do a weekend tournament, are there hotel/meal allowances?
• If you are doing a national tournament and are coming from a different state, are airline fares included?
• I assume the strictest of dress codes are in place, including no "silver pants" and western cut pockets mandatory so no one can see the inner lining of your pockets .
• If there are no re-imbursable expenses [other than perhaps a game fee] does that mean that only financially independent people are likely to be officiating the games [especially a higher state or national levels]?
• If you work a state or national tournament do you make money or lose money?
• What path does the rec league umpire take to get to state/national level tournaments?

[Steve M]

I'll answer some of these - but I can't address all of them.
Yes, you do get paid - check with the tournament directors as to how much.
The vast majority will be 2-man games.
Travel money depends on the tournament director, but most do not.
Lodging is usually provided and sometimes some meal money - check with your tournament director.
Strict dress codes are not always in place, but if you are somebody who has been brought in, you'd better believe that all are going to be watching you - how you dress, how you perform and how you conduct yourself off the field.
State tournaments - you'll make money. Nationals - probably not. In both, it's due to the number of games that you'll work.
Everyone follows the same path - through your district.

[Duke]

I too am from the Northeast. I have been an ASA/Federation ump for the past 15 years. Actually I am the UIC of a small board of about 20 umpires. Here in my state ASA covers the high schools.

I travel up to two hours one way to call ASA State and Regional tourneys. Most are held within 45 minute drive. No mileage reimburstment. I would say I usually make a small amount of money at these tourneys. If I choose to stay over night and not travel the hotel costs are on me. I have called three Nationals as a Host Exhange so travel has been on me. Two of these I drove and one I flew to. The last National was this past summer in Virginia when gas cost were at their highest. The Nationals cost me money but I am fortunate that my finacial status allows me the luxury to spend the money.
The path I took was to work many State tourneys then Regionals to get the recognition needed to move on to Nationals.

All our games at the State and Regional level at two man until you reach the final rounds when we start working three man.

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu

Howdy,

I'll give it a shot from my experience.

• Do you get paid for games and if so, how much?

• 6
  
  Yes, I got paid quite a bit for NFHS but ASA championships are relatively low paying if you are just looking that the game fee itself.
  
  

  Are games 2, 3, or 4 person umpire mechanics?

  In my experience they are normally 2 in the early rounds and some higher level tourneys move to 3 for the big games.
  
  

  Are there mileage reimbursements for umpires who travel long distances?
  

  NFHS - Yes
  ASA - sometimes - some tournaments I have gotten some mileage or travel pay but it is fairly rare.
  
  

  If you're going to do a weekend tournament, are there hotel/meal allowances?

  Many regular tournaments I get that. Nationals or other big tournaments - if you are not local, you will usually get that.
  
  

  If you are doing a national tournament and are coming from a different state, are airline fares included?

  Sometimes - there are different classifications of umpires and depending your classification your fare will be paid by your association, or you, or the host.
  
  

  I assume the strictest of dress codes are in place, including no "silver pants" and western cut pockets mandatory so no one can see the inner lining of your pockets .
  If there are no re-imbursable expenses [other than perhaps a game fee] does that mean that only financially independent people are likely to be officiating the games [especially a higher state or national levels]?

  That is not my experience -no. In fact few umpires I know, least of all me, are of that classification.
  
  

  If you work a state or national tournament do you make money or lose money?

  State and National tournaments are not the same at all. You will usually get paid less at a ASA National than a local metro or state tourney.
  I would classify nationals a losing money deal but the experience is still awesome.
  
  NFHS - you make money and good money.
  
  

  What path does the rec league umpire take to get to state/national level tournaments?

You probably need to get in the travel ball association and start working Travel ball tournaments. Contact the UIC.

Essentially, your weekly tournies and leagues are your money makers. You wont make money and probably will spend much more than you do make at Nationals - but it is a blast.

Those are my answers as far as I know.

[NCASAUmp]

I'll give it a stab, too, from my own personal experience...

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu

Do you get paid for games and if so, how much?

Yes, but how much you get paid will depend upon what you're calling. Varying levels equals varying pay.

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu

Are games 2, 3, or 4 person umpire mechanics?

All depends on the UIC of the tournament. Most tourneys will start with 2-umpire systems, some will go with 3-umpire systems.

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu

Are there mileage reimbursements for umpires who travel long distances?

Sometimes, but to cut down costs, I've heard that some tournaments are trying to get away from that. The more local umpires a tourney has, the less it has to reimburse for mileage. Remember, you can also deduct mileage on your taxes.

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu

If you're going to do a weekend tournament, are there hotel/meal allowances?

Sometimes. It depends on the level and who's doing the hosting. You'll probably get some sort of a lunch provided to you, but don't get your hopes too high. Sometimes, it's just hot dogs. Others have more lavish spreads.

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu

If you are doing a national tournament and are coming from a different state, are airline fares included?

Again, my understanding is that they're trying to minimize that. Don't expect to encounter that too often.

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu

I assume the strictest of dress codes are in place, including no "silver pants" and western cut pockets mandatory so no one can see the inner lining of your pockets .

For a National, absolutely. You must absolutely dress 100% ASA. A state tourney might not be so strict, but you should still dress like it's a National. It will reflect positively upon you.

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu

If there are no re-imbursable expenses [other than perhaps a game fee] does that mean that only financially independent people are likely to be officiating the games [especially a higher state or national levels]?

Hey, the pay may not be great, but none of us are doing this for free! Most of us also have full-time jobs.

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu

If you work a state or national tournament do you make money or lose money?

You make some money. Not a lot, though. You'll probably make more at a State tourney, due to the fact that you probably won't have to travel as far.

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu

What path does the rec league umpire take to get to state/national level tournaments?

My recommendation is to never "look" to get a tournament. Keep an "if it happens, it happens" attitude around your association. If you ask about it too often, it can rub people the wrong way. I'd recommend keeping an attitude of wanting to improve yourself and your association. Don't say a word about it; let your umpiring skills do all your talking for you.

[CelticNHBlue]

Tru-

Welcome a-board (ha). I can provide you some very accurate answers to your questions and more since I am also in NH. Feel free to email or pm me and I can fill you in on anything and everything ASA in NH and throughout New England. Glad to have a fellow local umpire here.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu

Some of these tournaments, while in the state that I reside, are a long distance away. Some might be an hour's drive one way, some a couple of hour's drive.

You call that long???

Heck, I work high schools that are that far away on a regular basis. During the playoffs, it is nothing to drive 3+ hours one way. Don't get me started on the distances to some of the colleges I umpire for!

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by Skahtboi

...During the playoffs, it is nothing to drive 3+ hours one way....

I used to have a car like that...

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Skahtboi

You call that long???

"long" is a relative term. Traveling an hour is a deal breaker to some in this area, umpires and players alike.

[Chess Ref]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

My recommendation is to never "look" to get a tournament. Keep an "if it happens, it happens" attitude around your association. If you ask about it too often, it can rub people the wrong way. I'd recommend keeping an attitude of wanting to improve yourself and your association. Don't say a word about it; let your umpiring skills do all your talking for you.

I have the "if it happens attitude" and it has served me well. 5th year umpiring, 2 nationals, 1 championship game at Nationals, a Sectional championship game in HS-as far as we go in our area in California, some pretty top end playoff games.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by Chess Ref

I have the "if it happens attitude" and it has served me well. 5th year umpiring, 2 nationals, 1 championship game at Nationals, a Sectional championship game in HS-as far as we go in our area in California, some pretty top end playoff games.

That's awesome, man. Last year was my 16th year, and I got invited to my first National. It only took over 15 years, but hey... I was invited. Someone eventually noticed me, and I was honored to be entrusted with that responsibility. I never looked for a tourney, never asked to call one, never even hinted at it.

As I always tell my assignor, "I call whatever you put in front of me."

[wmblue]

I was invited to do 2 games at a JO state tournament last year which would have meant about 3 1/2 hours driving round trip. This is when the price of gas was around $4/gal. I also had a commitment to another game the same day, and decided to honor that commitment rather than bolt for the limelight.

I hope your association is really understanding of your not taking a state tournament.

If they chose you one it means you evaluated well and are worthy of doing one. Unless the game you were doing was of higher importance, skipping out on a state tournament is highly frowned upon and unless there are no umpires wanting to work them in the future, good luck getting another one for awhile.

If that's harsh, I apologize, I've been walked out on by umpires I've given assignments to and don't enjoy dealing with it when it happens.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by wmblue

I hope your association is really understanding of your not taking a state tournament.

If they chose you one it means you evaluated well and are worthy of doing one. Unless the game you were doing was of higher importance, skipping out on a state tournament is highly frowned upon and unless there are no umpires wanting to work them in the future, good luck getting another one for awhile.

If that's harsh, I apologize, I've been walked out on by umpires I've given assignments to and don't enjoy dealing with it when it happens.

And that's a bit of a catch-22. The book says to honor all commitments, regardless of convenience or monetary factors. But you run the risk of being told "screw you" if you don't skip out on a commitment so you can call their tourney.

I think most reasonable people will understand that an umpire's word is everything. If s/he says they will be there, they WILL be there. If I were running a tourney, I'd be frustrated, but I wouldn't fault the umpire who tells me he's already committed to another game or tourney.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

And that's a bit of a catch-22. The book says to honor all commitments, regardless of convenience or monetary factors. But you run the risk of being told "screw you" if you don't skip out on a commitment so you can call their tourney.

What "book" would that be?

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

What "book" would that be?

Didn't you read his post??? He said Catch 22.