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-   -   But is he a Smitty? (https://forum.officiating.com/softball/47389-but-he-smitty.html)

greymule Wed Aug 20, 2008 11:27am
Yup. Gotta beware of those Christians. In fact, how dare Christianity be the single greatest influence upon the Western world?

But like it or not, it's in the air we breathe. Our government may be secular, but our laws and our culture derive from our understanding of just what a human being is and what that person's rights and responsibilities are—and that understanding was shaped heavily by European Christianity, as interpreted by theologians and philosophers and developed on this continent.

Just wondering—what kind of award would the Moslem world give to, say, a YSISF umpire who had sexually molested young boys?

"An eye for an eye" is often incorrectly interpreted to mean that poking people's eyes out is some kind of recommended punishment. In fact, the phrase is an example of how the punishment should be proportional to the crime, not more severe than warranted.

"Let him who is without sin among you cast the first stone" and "judge not, lest ye be judged" are warnings against hypocrisy, not dictates against punishing wrongdoing. "Turn the other cheek" does not mean let someone hammer you into the ground. (I'm working on the relevance of "if thine eye offend thee" to this situation.)

IRISHMAFIA Wed Aug 20, 2008 12:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by greymule
Yup. Gotta beware of those Christians. In fact, how dare Christianity be the single greatest influence upon the Western world?

But like it or not, it's in the air we breathe. Our government may be secular, but our laws and our culture derive from our understanding of just what a human being is and what that person's rights and responsibilities are—and that understanding was shaped heavily by European Christianity, as interpreted by theologians and philosophers and developed on this continent.

Just wondering—what kind of award would the Moslem world give to, say, a YSISF umpire who had sexually molested young boys?

"An eye for an eye" is often incorrectly interpreted to mean that poking people's eyes out is some kind of recommended punishment. In fact, the phrase is an example of how the punishment should be proportional to the crime, not more severe than warranted.

"Let him who is without sin among you cast the first stone" and "judge not, lest ye be judged" are warnings against hypocrisy, not dictates against punishing wrongdoing. "Turn the other cheek" does not mean let someone hammer you into the ground. (I'm working on the relevance of "if thine eye offend thee" to this situation.)
Right and the man has received his punishment. The only other entity to endow punishment would be a supreme being, correct?

And "turn the cheek" is tolerance. It is also an acknowledgment that a person can make a mistake and should be forgiven.

See, that is part of man's version of religion. Much like the constitution, so many items, written and preached, are vague enough to apply whatever interpretation fits your situation. If you guys parsed the bible and other doctrine like you do the ASA rule book, you would insist on throwing the hole thing out the window.

But y'all are still missing my point which is we really have no authority, religious or otherwise, to make judgments upon others. It is THEIR umpire group, THEIR award and THEY need to live with whatever they do. Too many people in this country think they have the moral authority to judge whomever they please and if you don't agree, you're an idiot. I do not agree with that philosophy.

Dakota Wed Aug 20, 2008 01:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA
...But y'all are still missing my point which is we really have no authority, religious or otherwise, to make judgments upon others. It is THEIR umpire group, THEIR award and THEY need to live with whatever they do. Too many people in this country think they have the moral authority to judge whomever they please and if you don't agree, you're an idiot. I do not agree with that philosophy.
AFAIK, you are the one who brought religion into this discussion here.

If you notice, the only comment I've made (other than pointing out how shallow your Biblical references were) was that these guys screwed up in the PR department. I never said they should not have given the award. They should not have been surprised by the reaction and the fact that they took back the award says (to me) that they didn't think this thing through. If they had, they would have either been prepared for the bad press and stuck to their decision, or they would have never given the award in the first place.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA
...If you guys parsed the bible and other doctrine like you do the ASA rule book, you would insist on throwing the hole thing out the window...
I've spent much more time with Bible study and with comparative doctrine study than the ASA rule book, and I would do no such thing. But this is not the forum to debate such issues.

jwwashburn Wed Aug 20, 2008 05:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA
Right and the man has received his punishment. The only other entity to endow punishment would be a supreme being, correct?

Who said anything about punishing him? Not giving him an award is not a punishment. The outrage is that they rewarded him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA
And "turn the cheek" is tolerance. It is also an acknowledgment that a person can make a mistake and should be forgiven..
I do not tolerate what this guy did, nor should I. He did not sin against me, so I cannot offer him forgiveness. He sinned against his victims and against God. I have no idea if he is sorry he did it or just sorry he got caught, by the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA
But y'all are still missing my point which is we really have no authority, religious or otherwise, to make judgments upon others. It is THEIR umpire group, THEIR award and THEY need to live with whatever they do. Too many people in this country think they have the moral authority to judge whomever they please and if you don't agree, you're an idiot. I do not agree with that philosophy.
We have a responsibilivy to judge in some instances. They did something in public and a lot of the public judged it to be wrong. Part of them living with what they did is that people have reacted to their decision

IRISHMAFIA Wed Aug 20, 2008 11:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwwashburn
WHo said anything about punisshing him? Not giving him an award is not a punishment. The outrage is that they rewarded him.
That would have been greymule. Maybe you should actually try reading all of the thread instead of being so intent upon delivering your personal message.

Quote:
I do not tolerate what this guy did, nor should I. He did not sin against me, so I cannot offer him forgiveness. He sinned against his victims and against God. I have no idea if he is sorry he did it or just sorry he got caught, by the way.
Which, again, if you actually read the threads you should understand no one is disagreeing with you.

Quote:
We have a responsibilivy to judge in some instances. They did something in public and a lot of the public judged it to be wrong. Part of them living with what they did is that people have reacted to their decision
And that, sir, is a personal opinion, but again, nothing that anyone is disagreeing with you.


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