Am I A Softie ?

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by BuggBob

An ejected player in NFHS is expected to stay on the bench, after all you can't have little girls wondering around without adult supervision. The main difference here is with an ejection the player is also suspended for the next game. With this restriction there is no record therefore no additional suspension.

F-bombs buy you the pine modified seat (a spanking) where I grew up.

Bugg

NFHS refers to "ejections" basically as restriction to the bench. There is no differentiation. And by the book, there is no suspension for the next game. That may be a local rule you are referring to.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by Skahtboi

NFHS refers to "ejections" basically as restriction to the bench. There is no differentiation. And by the book, there is no suspension for the next game. That may be a local rule you are referring to.

Again, speaking NFHS, the NFHS rule book makes a clear distinction between a restriction to the bench and an ejection. See NFHS rules 2-19, 2-48, and 3-6-20. Ejection is a more serious sanction than restriction.

All states that I know of (which, I admit, is only a few) suspend ejected players, but not restricted players.

NFHS does make a concession to the in loco parentis responsibilities of the schools by not requiring minor children to leave the area. But that does not make ejection = restriction to the bench.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by Dakota

Again, speaking NFHS, the NFHS rule book makes a clear distinction between a restriction to the bench and an ejection. See NFHS rules 2-19, 2-48, and 3-6-20. Ejection is a more serious sanction than restriction.

All states that I know of (which, I admit, is only a few) suspend ejected players, but not restricted players.

NFHS does make a concession to the in loco parentis responsibilities of the schools by not requiring minor children to leave the area. But that does not make ejection = restriction to the bench.

But, in NFHS an ejected player is restricted to the bench area. I guess that was the point I was trying make. And if a state does not have a clause which suspends an ejected player, then ejection does, in essence, equal restriction to the bench.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by BuggBob

An ejected player in NFHS is expected to stay on the bench, after all you can't have little girls wondering around without adult supervision.

Not the umpire's issue. If the violation was bad enough to warrant an ejection as opposed to a bench restriction (and in this case I believe it did), the player should be gone. Babysitting her is the school's problem.

If you really want to instill the idea of what not to do on a ball field, dump the player. It probably will not happen again especially if an assistant coach has to sit on the bus or in the parking lot with the player.

[Andy]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Not the umpire's issue. If the violation was bad enough to warrant an ejection as opposed to a bench restriction (and in this case I believe it did), the player should be gone. Babysitting her is the school's problem.

If you really want to instill the idea of what not to do on a ball field, dump the player. It probably will not happen again especially if an assistant coach has to sit on the bus or in the parking lot with the player.

Mike - while I agree with you in philosophy, the NFHS considers the practical side to this rule as well. Often, especially at the lower levels, there may only be one coach for a team. If an ejection requires the player to leave the field and an adult to go with her, the team may have to forfeit due to not having any other responsible school personnel available to coach the team.

As you say, not the umpire's issue, but that is the reasoning behind ejection/resticting to the bench in NFHS.

FWIW - here in AZ, we have to file a report if we eject or restrict to the bench.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Andy

Mike - while I agree with you in philosophy, the NFHS considers the practical side to this rule as well. Often, especially at the lower levels, there may only be one coach for a team. If an ejection requires the player to leave the field and an adult to go with her, the team may have to forfeit due to not having any other responsible school personnel available to coach the team.

As you say, not the umpire's issue, but that is the reasoning behind ejection/resticting to the bench in NFHS.

FWIW - here in AZ, we have to file a report if we eject or restrict to the bench.

Andy,

I am aware of that which is exactly why I said it would not happen again. I also understand an educational institutions responsibility, and liability, as it pertains to it's students.

Rant ON!

However, that doesn't excuse unacceptable behavior and HS is not the place for an organization to be soft about it.

Trust me, if as umpire I was asked to explain why s/he ejected the player, I would make a point of being in front of a group, preferably the school board and the player's parents and in a loud, deep voice repeat what this cute, little, couldn't-harm-a-fly child said to me. If I'm lucky, it will be a Christian academy of some sort.

I've been in this situation. I was in the Navy (Phila. Naval Base) and worked LL games on base. A 10 yo kid said (assumingly) the same thing which was raised in this post. I tossed the kid. When Master Chief Long called me to his office to explain myself, I told him in a loud, gruff manner in front of an office of mixed gender, including civilians, that the kid said, "ARE YOU F***ING BLIND!"

The chief was a bit embarrassed, but I only answered the question he asked. He tried to justify the kid's comment by noting we were dealing with military brats. I asked him what would happen if at 10, he had said the same thing to his mother or father. I was immediately dismissed and the kid sat the next two games. Never heard another comment like it or about it again.

We are the adults. As game officials, we are supposed to be the responsible adults. We are supposed to do what is good for the game, not baby sit smart-*** kids that believe this is acceptable behavior, not only on the ball field, but with any adult.

Rant OFF!

[Ed Maeder]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

We are the adults. As game officials, we are supposed to be the responsible adults. We are supposed to do what is good for the game, not baby sit smart-*** kids that believe this is acceptable behavior, not only on the ball field, but with any adult.

AMEN to that Mike.

[Chess Ref]

So after reading through these threads and the corresponding rules it looks like the swearing is an ejection. Now I know. i restricted her versus ejection because I didn't know the rules around that. Not because I wanted to contribute to the fall and decline of western civilization or that I'm not assertive enough,I just didn't know the rules. Next time i will eject.

I am learning the dynamics around softball. In basketball I know,usually, how to handle the coaches/players whats inappropriate etc. Softball has a whole nother vibe to it.

[LIIRISHMAN]

Ejection or restiction to the bench call it whatever you want. The point being that player once they use the "F" word is Going,Going GONE!!! You have lost her or his respect and they need to leave the game.Otherwise you make it tough on the next official.Also at least here in NY we can be held liable if the player(student) leaves the field without supervision.In that case I would let her staty on the bench with the understanding she can't partciapate in any way with the team until the game ends.

[Andy]

Originally Posted by Chess Ref

So after reading through these threads and the corresponding rules it looks like the swearing is an ejection.

Not necessarily. IMO, swearing in the following situations warrants an ejection:

Swearing at the umpire...
Swearing at an opponent...
Swearing loud enough for the guy at the top of the bleachers to hear...

Swearing in the following situations may not be an ejection:

Swearing under the breath due to a bad play or error..
Friendly banter between teammates as pointed out earlier in the thread..

A recent example: Good hitter at the plate, F1 is not giving her anything to hit. F1 makes a mistake and floats a pitch right down the middle. Batter crushes the pitch about 20' beyond the fence. As the bat hit the ball, I hear F2 say "Oh, sh!t!" just about loud enough for me to hear.

After BR has rounded the bases, I just tell F2 that I understand her feelings, but try to keep the language under control. She agreed and we finished the ball game.

Originally Posted by Chess Ref

I am learning the dynamics around softball. In basketball I know,usually, how to handle the coaches/players whats inappropriate etc. Softball has a whole nother vibe to it.

Isn't this the truth! It's tough not having that intermediate step like a technical foul where you can issue a warning with a penalty and still allow the offender to be part of the game.

[Chess Ref]

Andy-I agree with your take on the swearing I can talk to the player about. In this case i should have ejected. In our area it does matter if player is restricted or ejected,if ejected player is then suspended for the next game.

[Gulf Coast Blue]

The casual F* bomb........has become a bit too casual in my book, but I am not the language police.

However, I have warned......resticted to the bench........but never ejected a player because of it. I have also called games where I have heard that word and pretty much ignored it.

I would however, have a hard time NOT ejecting a player who while looking directly at me said "are you f$%ing blind!"

Just as I admire good catchers who always seem to say the right thing, I can despise a catcher who chirps about every damn thing he/she thinks is wrong. They both get the same consideration............but if a coach asks me how his catcher did........I will give them an honest evaluation......the griper gets D - and the encourager gets A+.

JMHO

Joel