Hit by pitch out of the box

[greymule]

Well, I had never seen this one before. ASA girls FP tournament. The batter ran up toward the pitcher to bunt for a hit and stepped in front of the box—she'd have been out if she made contact—but laid off and the pitch hit her.

Although the batter really couldn't avoid the pitch, she was indeed out of the box. The ump called HBP, and I can't disagree, but I'm not 100% sure.

Do you think that call was correct?

[U_of_I_Blue]

I can't say I've ever seen this before either. No rule citation to back me up on this, but if I judge that she made no attempt to move out of the path, I've got a dead ball and a ball (unless the pitch was coming over the plate) get back in the box and let's continue. If the batter has exited the batters box (except in an attempt to avoid the pitch) I'm not going to award her a base for being somewhere she shouldn't have. Maybe this should be treated as a situation where the batter makes contact with the ball with a foot out of the box where the batter is out. But at this point in time, I'd be hard pressed to award first base.

-Josh

[whiskers_ump]

In NCAA ball if the batter is hit by a pitch as she runs forward out of the front
of the batter's box, assuming she did not swing or attempt to bunt. It is a No Pitch

[SRW]

ASA 8-1-F makes no mention of the batter being in the box at the time of the HBP.

ASA 7-4-I says that a strike is called if it hits the batter while in the strike zone. However, the strike zone is always over the top of the plate (Rule 1). With your sitch, she was not hit in the strike zone.

It can't be an out like U_of_I_Blue suggests for making contact outside the box: ASA 7-6-D specifically states the ball contact is with the bat (not the body).

I think I've got a HBP...assuming she attempted to move out of the way. Otherwise Dead ball-ball.

However: Another line of thinking: ASA 7-3-D: Batter interference. It's not exactly the right call, but worth conversation here. Thoughts?

[greymule]

I've been trying to think of parallel situations and reasoning. If the batter is in front of the box (out of the box toward the pitcher), she could be hit with a curve ball that was inside when it made contact but still had a chance to become a strike. And if a right-handed batter (the girl in the play I saw was left-handed) left the box in front of the plate in a similar show-bunt-and-then-lay-off move, we'd have to call a dead ball strike. If a batter is hit after backing out of the box in an attempt to avoid a pitch behind her, that is HBP.

Obviously, the same criteria about trying to avoid have to apply.

Glad to know the NCAA rule since I am doing NCAA this year. (I don't have a rule book, but they said to download the document from their site. Until recently, the on-line book stopped somewhere in the middle, just before obstruction!)

[Skahtboi]

Greymule:

I suggest that you buy the rule book, as it is rather thick and will take a while to print after you download it. Also, the bought version is a lot easier to carry around.

[whiskers_ump]

Originally posted by Skahtboi
Greymule:

I suggest that you buy the rule book, as it is rather thick and will take a while to print after you download it. Also, the bought version is a lot easier to carry around.

I totally agree with Scott. I would also purchase the NCAA Softball Umpire Manual.

[outathm]

The manual is next to impossible to print out in the downloaded form. However, if you download it to a disk you can use the 'edit' tool to find what you need quickly and let the computer do the work. I have a copy of the Rulebook/manual disk in my laptop for all of my UIC Tourneys. It stops the 45 minute nit-noid discussions before they start. I can also use it to find the right page in a hurry before I go out onto the field and waste game time looking for it it the book.