Coverage at 1b on walk

[outathm]

I have a mechanical question here. R1 on 2B. RB walks. BR rounds 1B and stops. Pitcher has the ball in the cirsle and is standing there with no motion or play attempt anywhere. I am BU and have taken my mask off and followed the BR to 1B. R1 takes off with the pitch and goes to 3B. Who's call is the hesitation (Circle violation, LBR) on the runner at 1B. I kind of feel like it's my call, but I so not want to poach on my FU's call. Thanks for the help.

[CecilOne]

(PU = plate, BU = bases)
1) A violation of the RCR is not a specific responsibility for anyone, it belongs to whoever is responsible for that runner.
2) Just a stop is not a violation unless the runner stays at that spot beyond your sense of "immediate" in "immediately" moving toward one base or the other.
3) Give the runner the benefit of the doubt.
4) In you scenario, R1 ran on the pitch and if the BU went with R1, the BU can't be watching for RCR at 1st until R1 stops. Unless of course, both umpires realize that the lead runner is PU resp. and the trail runner is BU resp.
5) The PU should not be trailing a BR to 1st with a runner on 2nd or 3rd.

[streamdoc]

I would say that whichever umpire sees the LBR violation should call it. In fact, I had this exact situation earlier in the season, and my PU called it. With a runner advancing from 2nd to 3rd on the play you describe, the base umpire should be paralleling (sp?) the runner for a possible throw from the catcher, so the PU should be watching the BR as she makes her way to 1st on the BB. Of course, this assumes 2-umpire system rather than 3.

Just wanted to add that this is a good topic for your pre-game discussion between umpires.

[Edited by streamdoc on Jun 2nd, 2005 at 01:06 PM]

[outathm]

I wasnt trailing the runner, I was watching from the holding area. the lead runner is not the PU's responsibility in this cased because it was a steal not a play. I was just concerned about wether or not I was Poaching on my BU's call. I agree it could be covered in the pregame, but this is rec ball and we do not always have the ability to get a pregame in with both umpires coming from work for a 5:45 game. This is not a standard discussion in the pregame, and with an in depth pregame I probably would have talked about it.

In response to Cecil, and with proper deference to a senior member, I am aware that a stop does not constitute LBR but a stop for as long as this was is why I wasked the question.

[AtlUmpSteve]

With R1 stealing on the pitch, BU, starting in C position, works toward 3B for the possible play. R1 obviously arrives well before BR reaches 1B, in fact, probably before BR even steps toward 1B (if well coached, is staying in the catcher's way, if less well-coached, she is spectating). We are in the same general positions now as if R1 was on 3B at the start of the pitch.

It strikes me that, in most cases, there is sufficient time to make the adjustment that allows the most control. As PU, I would be headed to the holding zone between 3B and home, telling the BU I now have the lead runner (as soon as the steal play is over and he has no immediate call).

At that point, BU heads into the middle of the infield, directly toward 1B, and actively takes the BR (trail runner), as PU has assumed responsibility for R1 (lead runner). This transfer makes clear who has what call, and demonstrates to the the other two teams on the field that this team is in control. Further, failing to make that transfer will really muddy the waters if the play develops where BR continues to 2B (in your mechanic, PU takes her to 2B??), and R1 breaks for home (BU follows her home??). IMO, the transfer needs to take place as soon as R1 reaches 3B safely.

[streamdoc]

Steve, I can see your point, and how that works. I guess I was thinking back to when the situation has happened in the past, and my PU made the LBR call at 1st. It was the first time that I had seen it, and know it, so it was probably a good thing that he called it for me. Since we are taught as BU to observe the BR to first, it seemed logical that they could call the LBR violation. However, I can see how that might not work when their attention is (and should be) drawn to R1 on 3rd as you mention. For me, this seems to be one of those mechanics that works well on the field, but is hard to put into words for me.

And before John jumps on me here, I'll say that I in no way meant that the PU has the BR to 2nd and the BU has to cover home. (I'd use the little smiley here, but can't figure out how to)

[CecilOne]

Originally posted by outathm
I wasnt trailing the runner, I was watching from the holding area. the lead runner is not the PU's responsibility in this cased because it was a steal not a play. I was just concerned about wether or not I was Poaching on my BU's call. I agree it could be covered in the pregame, but this is rec ball and we do not always have the ability to get a pregame in with both umpires coming from work for a 5:45 game. This is not a standard discussion in the pregame, and with an in depth pregame I probably would have talked about it.

In response to Cecil, and with proper deference to a senior member, I am aware that a stop does not constitute LBR but a stop for as long as this was is why I wasked the question.

Don't take eother comment personally or even as directed to you. I just like to throw in clarifications for those readers that might be less knowledgeable or misled.

And yes, I agree that the transfer of runners described by Steve is the logical step.

[Dakota]

Originally posted by streamdoc
(I'd use the little smiley here, but can't figure out how to)

Click on Smilies at the top of the reply page and it will explain all!

[bkbjones]

Steamdoc,
I can't jump on you. If I do, then moi would be doing your six games on Saturday in beautiful Tukwila.

[streamdoc]

O.k. I'm outa this thread, but here's to wishing you all have sun, good games, safe and fun times this weekend. Hopefully I'll return home at midnight Saturday looking like this

I just had to try the smiley thing - thanks Dakota.