How many warm up pitches?

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by Shmuelg
Blue,

Although I think you were technically correct, IMO, you went a bit too far with the letter of the rules, and not with the spirit of the rules, especially in a rec league.

I disagree. There is a reason those rules are in place and it isn't just to take up space in the rule book. Game control, after all, is part of the umpire's job.

And if you ask me, Sean enforced the rule IN the spirit meant since it's existence is to avoid delays in the game while insuring all pitchers receive equal consideration.

[Shmuelg]

Well since I had informed the battery that they got three warmup pitches, and since the pitcher blatantly disregarded the rule after I had told them, I had to stick to it.

Yea, I guess you're right, then.

[Dakota]

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA

You want "speed up", use the one minute. A hustling SP pitcher may get in three, but I don't know of a JO pitcher that would get to three, let alone five.

I agree... remember, I was explaining the league's rule and rationale, not mine. Although, given the, ahem, variety of umpires the league deals with, it is probably a more reliable speed-up approach than trying to get the 1 minute enforced. The catchers are pretty self-enforcing on the 5-3 rule.

My other point is that a local rule like this would have no impact on the same team when they reach championship play, since no one will complain when they stop at 3 warmup pitches. There may be an occasional gripe from a coach when the other team uses 5, though.

[Dakota]

Originally posted by Dutch Alex
Tom,
How local is your FP league? In the Netherlands we have the same rules.

It's a very large league, but it is not THAT big!

[FUBLUE]

JO tournaments FP we use 5 of they hustle out, 3 if they don't, or 1 or none...most pitchers were hustling out and getting the pitches in.

HS FP ball, several of the better pitchers in this area take 3 at most. One only wants one pitch.

I never took any...let's play.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by Dakota

My other point is that a local rule like this would have no impact on the same team when they reach championship play, since no one will complain when they stop at 3 warmup pitches.

Yeah, right. Tom, wake up, you are dreaming.

[Dakota]

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA

Yeah, right. Tom, wake up, you are dreaming.

Maybe you misunderstand what I said - or maybe I am dreaming - a team that is used to only 3 warmups, and therefore calls "balls in..." after 2 will get no complaints from the umpires at a national.

[Dakota]

While I don't rigorously (i.e. check my timer) enforce the 1 minute, I do use the rule. I have disallowed ANY warmups, or limited them to 1, when teams lollygag around, whether it is the catcher not being ready, or the coach wanting to have a team meetings, or the pitcher just screwing around,.. whatever. I've never had any griping about it, either. I give some leeway if the catcher was on base or at bat, but she'd better be making visible effort to hurry.

The reason is not to get the game over sooner - these are timed games - the reason is to give the players more playing time within the time limit.

[UmpireErnie]

I agree Dakota!

Here in The Last Frontier we have no special local rules for warm up pitches so we just go with the 5 pitches or 1 minute rule (ASA/NFHS). I will tell both of my catchers "Don't wait for us to tell you, take charge and call Balls In after 4 pitches". Then I monitor that when I am not busy between innings by counting the pitches. It is usually self enforcing, and I am not counting seconds or looking at my watch.

But if the team is slow coming out on the feild, or F2 was on base and nobody else comes out to warm up F1 I will use the 1-minute rule to goose em along. "Half of your minute is gone, Team, let's husle out!" Then maybe call "Balls In" after only one pitch. Slow teams will get the idea after an inning or two.

Some coaches try to hold a big team conference outside the dugout between innings. If this is the defense the same tactic works.. "Only one minute between innings, Coach, and it's half gone! Better put 'em on the feild!"

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by Dakota
a team that is used to only 3 warmups, and therefore calls "balls in..." after 2 will get no complaints from the umpires at a national.

Maybe you misunderstood my point. Teams and coaches will complain about anything, right, wrong or indifferent.

If his/her pitcher hustles out there, takes three and is ready to go, that's great. But because they are use to just getting three (FP) at home and all of a sudden see another team taking five, the complaints will come if they are unaware of the actual rule.

[Bluefoot]

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA

Maybe you misunderstood my point. Teams and coaches will complain about anything, right, wrong or indifferent.

If his/her pitcher hustles out there, takes three and is ready to go, that's great. But because they are use to just getting three (FP) at home and all of a sudden see another team taking five, the complaints will come if they are unaware of the actual rule.

YES! THAT is exactly my point. Invariably teams complain about anything. Especially prima donna pitchers (yes, even in SP). Even though I stick to the ASA 3 warm pitches, some players still complain because other umpires are inconsistent, or don't know the rules. They give them 5 in the first inning, then 3 thereafter, or 3 in the first, and only 1 after that. That's when I hear, "But (so and so) lets us have (x number) of pitches!" This take can be applied to many ASA rule misapplications, as we know.

By holding firm to the rules and using ASA as my guide, I reduce some of the whining when teams see that I am consistent and providing no advantage for either team, or letting a team dictate what the rules are. But in my 3 years, noone in SP still knows this rule, so I'll probably be enforcing it as long as I continue to go behind the plate.