Wow! Memory is a wonderful thing!

[Dakota]

Had a very rare call last night.

14U ASA game, 1 umpire "system" (some system!). Count 1-0. B1 hits a sharp grounder directly to F5, who cleanly fields the ball and throws her out at first.

3B Coach requests TIME. Points out F5 is wearing a 1st baseman's mitt.

Oh, crap! Coach starts "coaching" me that the batter gets 1st base. I decide to inspect the glove to both determine that it truly is illegal, and to buy time. I tell the coach to be quiet. As I am walking toward F5, the effect pops into my head.

After inspecting the glove, I inform the coach he has a choice: batter back into the box with the 1-0 count, or the results of the play. (Guess which he picks.)

Batter grounds out ~5 pitches later.

[chuck chopper]

Once in a lifetime occasion if figure. Good memory !

[tchaap]

Great post Dakaota.

As a first year ump these are the comments that really make this board great.

TChaap

[SamNVa]

Great call Tom,

I think the best lesson for the newer umpires to take away from this play is:

I decide to inspect the glove to both determine that it truly is illegal, and to buy time. I tell the coach to be quiet. As I am walking toward F5, the effect pops into my head.

I'll bet that if the coach had been blathering in your ear the whole way to 3rd, you would have never have gotten to the correct answer and most likely would have ruled in his favor.

One of the most important things to do when an unusual situation pops up is to give yourself some quiet time to allow the old neurons to find hte right answer.

SamC

[whiskers_ump]

Tom,

Good Call, Good thinking.

[TexBlue]

Ahhh, the quiet voice of experience speaks up and is heard!
Good move, good call. But, you know, I betcha you woulda got it right, even if we hadn't discussed this a week or so ago.

Good Job

[Dakota]

Originally posted by TexBlue
But, you know, I betcha you woulda got it right, even if we hadn't discussed this a week or so ago.

I have my doubts!

[Robmoz]

okay......out of curiosity what about these issues?

1) At what point in the game did this occur?

2) Same sitch but with runners on base and lets say that R1 scores on the play...does D coach get the option to let play stand?

[chuck chopper]

Does not matter at what point in the game the wrong glove was used. Also it is the Batting teams coach who gets the option, not the defensive coach.

[Dakota]

Originally posted by Robmoz
okay......out of curiosity what about these issues?

1) At what point in the game did this occur?

In my case, middle innings somewhere, as implied by my use of B1, there were no runners on base.

Originally posted by Robmoz
2) Same sitch but with runners on base and lets say that R1 scores on the play...does D coach get the option to let play stand?

No, it is the O coach that gets the choice (the D committed the infraction). In your case, yes, he still does have the choice, but he has a tougher decision - keep the run and the out, or give back the run and nullify the out. His choice would be influenced by the overall game situation and the skill of the batter.

[Dakota]

Originally posted by TexBlue
But, you know, I betcha you woulda got it right, even if we hadn't discussed this a week or so ago.

I want to make one more comment about this...

When I "discovered" the umpiring boards, I realized that it was an exceptionally good learning tool, and an exceptionally good rules refresher class.

Of course, the "curriculum" of this classroom is very unstructured, but over time just about everything is covered, and many times from a different perspective that I would have thought of on my own.

The illegal glove call is so rare, a rational teacher would not waste class time with it. However, since we had recently discussed it here, the rule was without a doubt closer to the "top" of my recall, and was there when I needed it.

[chuck chopper]

Off topic now, however this board helps me keep my head on sometimes. Always knew a line drive that hits F3 or F5 & goes OB is a ground rule double. Then the other day I had a pop up to pitcher near 3rd base hit her glove & go OB and for some dumb reason I wanted to use the 2 bases from when it went out of play rule ???????. Then someone on the discussion board straightened that out for me. REFRESHER..REFRESHER..REFRESHER.

[Robmoz]

Originally posted by chuck chopper
...Does not matter at what point in the game the wrong glove was used.

I was leaning towards the thought of if it was later in the game why hadn't it been noticed beforehand. Yes, it is rare to see but it is something I do look for akin to checking for illegal bats, jewelery and uniform rules.

[DownTownTonyBrown]

This is obviously an ASA issue (NFHS doesn't care - size is the only requirement and it is applicable to the gloves of all players except the catcher).

NFHS Penalty for an illegal glove is the same as being quoted here.

What truly is the difference between a 1st baseman's glove and all the others? Does a 1st baseman's glove exceed the size limits of NFHS? In which case it would be illegal for any position, including 1st base. Why is this differentiation important to ASA?

Incidentally, I allowed a pitcher to use a 1st baseman's glove a couple of weeks ago during our High School State Tournament. I didn't get out a tape measure to ensure the glove wasn't too big... but did I mess up?

[mick]

Originally posted by Robmoz

I was leaning towards the thought of if it was later in the game why hadn't it been noticed beforehand.

Robmoz,
The coach may not have noticed it or may have wanted to keep it in the pocket until needed.
mick