Injuries during steals of home in Men's ASA SP?

Of course HP would have the best angle, but the worse situation. Reason HP "shouldn't" take the steal at 3rd is the possibility that the catcher has a bad arm and HP might have a slight concussion if the aim is really bad.

In Omaha here, we're doing this on an experimental basis for the Open League (top league in town), but other leagues won't use it. However, those teams have been told to expect it when playing in the state tournaments, etc.

[azbigdawg]

Yup...it would be a pain...the best option is to hope that the plate umpire will at least move out to have a second set of eyes on the plate.... Its just not gonna go over well making that call from that distance.... another thought....is anyone participating in a league where they are allowing stealing with ONE MAN UMPIRING?

One umpire and base stealing? Oh dear God! I'd like to know how that would work.

[azbigdawg]

There are areas that do that for whatever reason

[scottk_61]

Originally posted by azbigdawg
Mike, I gotta disagree with you...We tried it several times in a clinic and found out that being that far behind the play DOES NOT work. Too many chances to miss something Ideally HP has the best angle. But we know that they wont give him that call.

If you can't get that steal to third while working out of the B position, you are doing something wrong. Which is probably being too deep or simply not being ready.
The addition of stealing to the slow pitch game requires a bit more hustle than we had to do before.
Additionally, most of your plays are going to be at 1st or 2nd in todays game. Why would you want to start having to make a lot of long distance calls to first base from the C position.
Try that and get ready for a barrage of whining that makes the presidential campaign look like a poetry reading.
Like Mike says, get in line behind second and come inside for the call. This will give you the angle to be in position.

[azbigdawg]

Scott... Im always ready..and the level of the game and the position of the players dictate how deep you are.....and I know its gonna take more work from SP only umpires... Those of us that do both know how to handle it....Im just telling you that its not the ideal position

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by azbigdawg
Mike, I gotta disagree with you...We tried it several times in a clinic and found out that being that far behind the play DOES NOT work. Too many chances to miss something Ideally HP has the best angle. But we know that they wont give him that call.

Darrell,

I'm afraid I must equally disagree with you. Been there, done that (even with two bad knees) and, not only does it work, but it is the prescribed ASA mechanic (ASA Rule Book-Umpire Manual, pages 247-249). Don't know why it didn't work in your clinic.

The PU is lucky to have a two-dimensional view of a play at 3rd and you cannot bank on that.

The priority of the PU is track the ball, make the call and get the hell out of the way, sometimes all at the same time. You cannot base a standard mechanic on something as unpredictable as the bounce of a ball.

[scottk_61]

Originally posted by azbigdawg
Scott... Im always ready..and the level of the game and the position of the players dictate how deep you are.....and I know its gonna take more work from SP only umpires... Those of us that do both know how to handle it....Im just telling you that its not the ideal position

Careful there ASBIGSAWG, you are going to bite yourself.
I am not a SP only umpire but I do a lot of slow pitch ball along with modified and fast pitch.
I have worked this from both the B and C slot with National Staff umpires in trial runs and working form the C slot is not a good thing.
If you put on paper the number of plays at either 1st or 2nd, and then put on the number at 3rd from either hits or steals you will realize that far more of your effort is needed in the B slot.
There is no real need for a runner to steal 3rd after he gets to 2nd as he is already in scoring position. Granted it does happen but as the teams get used to working with stealing, the steal to 3rd is relatively rare.
I am not saying it won't happen but it is far less than one quickly imagines. The teams learn this and adjust.
Get on your wheels and you can get that play on that occasional steal to 3rd.
I am 43 with a bad ankle, 6'5" 280 lbs and I can get it with no problems. I have never been blocked out or too far behind the play.
Maybe the problem for you guys is that you are trying to stay too close to the base line when you move in.
Try getting an angle from the pitchers plate area, it will work.

[azbigdawg]

Guys..no offense..Im not interested in where ya been or who ya are.., and Im AWARE that its the prescribed mechanic, (or else I wouldnt have taught it at the clinc.)My point is that its NOT the ideal mechanic...thats all..even though we may see the play.. WE WILL catch a little flak about being out of position, and its not that it didnt work in our clinic... we just realized that they could have done a better job. Why should it be any different than the FP "C" position? (Which I dont like either). I guess I could just hope that sanity will reign and we will have 3man mechanics for all games... not

[Edited by azbigdawg on Mar 30th, 2004 at 12:00 PM]

[scottk_61]

Originally posted by azbigdawg
Guys..no offense..Im not interested in where ya been or who ya are.., and Im AWARE that its the prescribed mechanic, (or else I wouldnt have taught it at the clinc.)My point is that its NOT the ideal mechanic...thats all..even though we may see the play.. WE WILL catch a little flak about being out of position, and its not that it didnt work in our clinic... we just realized that they could have done a better job. Why should it be any different than the FP "C" position? (Which I dont like either). I guess I could just hope that sanity will reign and we will have 3man mechanics for all games... not

[Edited by azbigdawg on Mar 30th, 2004 at 12:00 PM]

3 man for games is a thing of the past, except for the finals at some nationals.
Get used to it and it will work.
I suspect that you aren't comfortable because of the newness of it.
Once you work it for a while, you won't understand why you thought you needed the C slot to begin with.

take care

[azbigdawg]

nooo..its not the NEWNESS..Im not comfortable because I took a look at it and saw too many disadvantages..and yes..I know about the 3man.... that was SARCASM...

[IRISHMAFIA]

Darrell,

If you didn't mean that it didn't work, you shouldn't have typed that it didn't work.

The difference is in FP, the SS is not as deep as in SP. Now, if you set up off the SS right shoulder in SP, you are going to be in a position to miss a lot more than from behind 2B.

If you set up on the left shoulder of the SS, you may very well be competing with him to reach a position behind 3rd to make a call. OTOH, if the runner is smart, they will be sliding to the outside which means you may miss the close tag on the throw coming from the opposite direction.

I don't think the NUS just decided, "Hey, let's really screw things up for Merle's last year". Bernie Profato offered this change to get more umpires involved in the game. This will force that issue. I know they would like to find a way for the PU to get involved, but the problem is that s/he may be involved in the play as more than just an observer.

[azbigdawg]

I guess when I said it didnt "work", I should have said "we didint think it was the ideal mechanic for that situation" sorrrrrrrrrrrrrrry...and I will kick the **** out of Bernie when I see him for getting me involved with this damn discussion...