Numberless batters

ktcowboys · #1 (**permalink**) Mon Oct 27, 2003, 10:04am

I recently attended a tournament. One evening it turned cold. The girls playing were wearing sweats (if they had them) windbreakers, etc. No problem with that, my question stems from the fact that the team we were playing had no numbers displayed on their sweats anywhere. I would like to know if it is not a requirement to have a uniform number on a batter at the time of batting to enable the official scorekeeper to know which batter is batting and to verify that they are in correct order. The umpire at this game did not think this was important.

I would appreciate an official rulebook response. Thank you!!!

Skahtboi · #2 (**permalink**) Mon Oct 27, 2003, 10:59am

From the USSSA Rulebook:

Sec.7. A. At all national and world qualifying tournaments, teams must wear identical uniforms. This includes jerseys, long pants or shorts and leggings. Whether long pants or shorts are worn, all team members must be uniformed alike. Caps are optional, however when worn they must be all alike and worn with the bill forward.

B. Non duplicating numbers will be required at all national and World Series qualifying tournaments. The numbers must be minimum of three inches in size and clearly visible.

Notice that the only requirement there for uniforms is at national and world qualifiers, and at all National and World tournaments. I do not have my ASA book with me at work, but I am sure that someone else will come along soon and supply that rule.

However, under USSSA rules, unless this tournament you are referring was one of the tournaments listed in the rule quoted, the umpire was correct.

Dakota · #3 (**permalink**) Mon Oct 27, 2003, 11:48am

If this was ASA Championship play (unlikly this time of year, I would guess), then strictly by the book says the jersey number must be visible.

However, in fall ball, we specifically state in the local rules that if the weather is cold, the uniform rules will not be strictly followed, and players may wear sweats, jackets, etc, and they do not need to match.

whiskers_ump · #4 (**permalink**) Mon Oct 27, 2003, 12:19pm

Agree with Tom. This was probably "fall ball" and usually
teams bat lineups and free substitution. However, if it was
championship play, number required to be visible. Surely some
sort of agreement was reached as to how to handle this. Have
player pull up warmup jacket and show number. No big deal unless
championship play, as I see it.

glen

whiskers_ump · #5 (**permalink**) Mon Oct 27, 2003, 12:24pm

BTW:

Welcome to the board ktcowboys.

A Sooner, I see. Hmmmm, kicked our a****.

glen

Steve M · #6 (**permalink**) Mon Oct 27, 2003, 04:09pm

During the high school season, we see a lot of this - uniform jerseys covered by sweatshirts or jackets. I have specifically allowed this and covered it during the pre-game get together at the plate. I'll tell each team that if there is any question as to who a player is, I will come to the coach. If I ran into this during an ASA game, I'd handle it the same way.

And I'll second Glen's welcome KT.

Addition - this year, everybody is beating up on Penn State.

Steve M

[Edited by Steve M on Oct 27th, 2003 at 03:13 PM]

CecilOne · #7 (**permalink**) Mon Oct 27, 2003, 04:12pm

I sometimes suggest wearing the uniform shirt over the top of the sweats or windbreaker, as we sometimes do. But that it mostly to distinguish the runners from the fielders, not for numbers.

chuck chopper · #8 (**permalink**) Tue Oct 28, 2003, 08:20am

Even in the summer on a drissly day, players will wear outerwear which covers the number. This is such a non-issue I have no trouble with it.
.
Just keeping the came on track is hard enough sometimes without US becoming part of the problem.

ktcowboys · #9 (**permalink**) Tue Oct 28, 2003, 09:32am

I really appreciate the responses to my questions, I am somewhat surprised by them. I would think that in any tournament where you have an official scorekeeper that in order for them to keep track of the lineup that numbers or names should at the very least be given to the official scorekeeper. I don't know about you guys, but it is not always easy to tell these girls apart when they have on helmets and sweats. If I were keeping score, I would want to know that the lineup was being followed and not feel that it needed to be questioned. Thank you!

One more question - this last weekend was the first time that any of us had seen the pitcher, catcher, and coach wearing wrist bands that apparently had pitches or plays on them. The pitcher referred to her's quite often. Are you familiar with this and can you tell me exactly what the purpose of these are?

I am not a "Sooner". I am a tried and true ORANGE COWBOY FAN.

GO POKES!!!!

IRISHMAFIA · #10 (**permalink**) Tue Oct 28, 2003, 11:08am

Quote:

Originally posted by ktcowboys
I really appreciate the responses to my questions, I am somewhat surprised by them. I would think that in any tournament where you have an official scorekeeper that in order for them to keep track of the lineup that numbers or names should at the very least be given to the official scorekeeper. I don't know about you guys, but it is not always easy to tell these girls apart when they have on helmets and sweats. If I were keeping score, I would want to know that the lineup was being followed and not feel that it needed to be questioned. Thank you!

You need to remember, the scorekeeper's job is to keep score. There is nothing a scorekeeper can do if there is a problem. If a wrong batter comes to the plate, the ONLY person who can do anything about it is the opponent. As noted before, if asked about a player's number, I would stop and check the player's number. In Championship Play, the number would be a priority. In a "friendly", especially at this time of year, I don't believe it is that big of a deal.

Quote:

One more question - this last weekend was the first time that any of us had seen the pitcher, catcher, and coach wearing wrist bands that apparently had pitches or plays on them. The pitcher referred to her's quite often. Are you familiar with this and can you tell me exactly what the purpose of these are?

Just like those worn by QBs in football. It probably has a pitch listed with a corresponding signal given by the coach.

Quote:

I am not a "Sooner". I am a tried and true ORANGE COWBOY FAN.

I was under the impression everyone from OK is considered a "sooner", but not necessarily an OU Sooner.

Good luck this week, take the Pokes and the points!

Elaine "Lady Blue" · #11 (**permalink**) Tue Oct 28, 2003, 11:20am

Welcome, KTCowboy!

Tell me, was the wrist band the pitcher wore on her pitching arm? If so, not legal.

IRISHMAFIA · #12 (**permalink**) Tue Oct 28, 2003, 11:33am

Quote:

Originally posted by Elaine "Lady Blue"
Tell me, was the wrist band the pitcher wore on her pitching arm? If so, not legal.

Speaking ASA, this is not necessarily true. It would only be illegal should the umpire deems it a distraction to the batter.

[Edited by IRISHMAFIA on Oct 29th, 2003 at 07:32 AM]

bluezebra · #13 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 29, 2003, 01:42am

At the plate conference: "Coaches, the weather is bad and we don't want any players to get sick. They may wear sweats, jackets, over their uniform jersey when on defense and when running the bases. Of course the pitcher may not wear anything distracting to the batter. When at bat, nothing may cover the uniform jersey. They may wear sweat shirts UNDER the jersey if they're more comfortable that way. They may also wear sweat pants over their uniform shorts".

Bob

IRISHMAFIA · #14 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 29, 2003, 08:33am

Quote:

Originally posted by bluezebra
At the plate conference: "Coaches, the weather is bad and we don't want any players to get sick. They may wear sweats, jackets, over their uniform jersey when on defense and when running the bases. Of course the pitcher may not wear anything distracting to the batter. When at bat, nothing may cover the uniform jersey. They may wear sweat shirts UNDER the jersey if they're more comfortable that way. They may also wear sweat pants over their uniform shorts".

Bob

Here's a thought. If the weather is bad, don't play the game!

WestMichBlue · #15 (**permalink**) Wed Oct 29, 2003, 09:01am

"Here's a thought. If the weather is bad, don't play the game!"

Ahhh Mike, you need to do more games around teenage girls. They will play regardless of the weather.

A few years ago I took my JV team to a Lake Michigan shoreline school for our season opener the first of April. We got off the bus to temps in the low 30's, winds, and snow flurries. Coaches wanted to cancel; kids wanted to play. We played! Maybe the best game of the year.

One summer night I was umpiring a HS summer league game and the rains came. I finally suspended the game and headed for shelter. Soon I had a bunch of 15 - 16 y.o. girls surrounding me; hassling me because I was "afraid to get wet." So we went back on the field, which now had water at home plate and around the bases. Those girls would do anything to get to 3B so they could come home. I had to duck the flying mud and water as they slid into home. They went home wet, muddy, and happy. I went home appreciating how much these girls love to play the game - and have fun when playing it.

WMB