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Old Thu May 18, 2017, 12:57pm
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Use of a slow pitch bat in a fast pitch game

Does anyone have information on the safety implications of allowing slow pitch (ie. lower compression) bats in a fast pitch game (14U level)? This happened in a rec game and the 12U pitcher almost took the batted ball to the head. It was noticed after the hit ball that the bat was a slow pitch bat.
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Old Thu May 18, 2017, 01:29pm
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Originally Posted by shanning View Post
Does anyone have information on the safety implications of allowing slow pitch (ie. lower compression) bats in a fast pitch game (14U level)? This happened in a rec game and the 12U pitcher almost took the batted ball to the head. It was noticed after the hit ball that the bat was a slow pitch bat.
not legal for JO. Can be used in men's ball
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Old Thu May 18, 2017, 02:35pm
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Sorry for being ignorant, but what makes it illegal in JO?
If a bat meets the size and weight requirements, has the proper BPF, and the appropriate ASA or USSSA seals on them, what makes them illegal?
In the NCAA them would have to be on the approved bat list.
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Last edited by Colo Blue; Thu May 18, 2017 at 02:39pm.
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Old Thu May 18, 2017, 03:01pm
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The bat had an ASA 2013 logo which by Rule 3 Section 1 is only to be used in Slow Pitch, Men's Adult Fast Pitch, Junior Olympic Boy's Fast Pitch and Men's Modified. This was JO girls fastpitch. Not sure if the term is illegal or not approved for JO girls or what.

I'm more interested in understanding if the safety issue of having a lower compression bat is something that would warrant, say ejection of the manager that allowed it. Maybe suspension of the manager if proved to be aware of the bat.

From what I understand, a lower compression bat (via shaving, rolling, or design ) can enhance the performance of the bat. That is the "cheating" aspect. But the safety aspect is that the unsafe BPF could cause a lack of response time from the defender (specifically pitcher at < 40' away) and a significant injury. After all, isn't that why USA Softball and USSSA do compression testing?
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Old Fri May 19, 2017, 10:31am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shanning View Post
The bat had an ASA 2013 logo which by Rule 3 Section 1 is only to be used in Slow Pitch, Men's Adult Fast Pitch, Junior Olympic Boy's Fast Pitch and Men's Modified. This was JO girls fastpitch. Not sure if the term is illegal or not approved for JO girls or what.

I'm more interested in understanding if the safety issue of having a lower compression bat is something that would warrant, say ejection of the manager that allowed it. Maybe suspension of the manager if proved to be aware of the bat.

From what I understand, a lower compression bat (via shaving, rolling, or design ) can enhance the performance of the bat. That is the "cheating" aspect. But the safety aspect is that the unsafe BPF could cause a lack of response time from the defender (specifically pitcher at < 40' away) and a significant injury. After all, isn't that why USA Softball and USSSA do compression testing?
The penalty for using that bat is the same as using any other illegal bat. The batter is declared out and ejected. 7-6-C.

When the 2013 stamp was introduced for SP only bats, it was the result of some adjustments to the testing procedures that determined the exit speed of the ball off the bat. There are several variables that make up the equation. One of those variables is bat speed. The number that was being used prior to 2013 was considered to be the average bat speed on the swing of a SP player. Some actual field studies were done to measure bat speed and it was discovered that the actual average was lower than the number being used in the formula. When the new number was plugged in, it allowed some bats that were not previously approved to now meet the exit speed threshold of 98 mph. These bats got the 2013 stamp. Since these studies were only done with the Slow Pitch game, the bats with these stamps were only allowed to be used in that game. Some additional swing speed surveys were then done for Men's and Boys FP and it was discovered that these bats would still meet the exit speed threshold in those games as well.

I had heard a couple of years ago that these same swing speed studies were planned for the Women's and JO FP games, but I have not heard if these studies have been done, or of any results.

So basically, there is no "safety" information to provide. It hasn't been studied (or released) yet. That is why these bats are illegal for the female FP game.

It's in a different category than a bat that has been altered by rolling or shaving.
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Old Fri May 19, 2017, 11:14am
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Originally Posted by Andy View Post
The penalty for using that bat is the same as using any other illegal bat. The batter is declared out and ejected. 7-6-C.

It's in a different category than a bat that has been altered by rolling or shaving.
So, these are classified as non-approved, not illegal??
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Old Fri May 19, 2017, 11:28am
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Originally Posted by CecilOne View Post
So, these are classified as non-approved, not illegal??
You are correct, per the terminology in the rules. The rule also uses the term Altered as opposed to illegal.

The bats with the 2013 stamp are non-approved for Women's and Girls JO FP.
The rule cited above still applies, however.
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Old Fri May 19, 2017, 12:46pm
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Thanks!
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Old Mon May 22, 2017, 12:47am
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Thanks for all the information from you subject matter experts. Very much appreciated...
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