Erroneous foul ball call

[fredhjr]

Batter moves in the box to avoid being hit by pitch. Ball hits bat, enters and comes to rest in fair territory. PU verbalizes "foul ball". Of course, this is an oops, but can the error be rectified? Would it be possible to call a "no pitch"?

[MT 73]

Originally Posted by fredhjr

Batter moves in the box to avoid being hit by pitch. Ball hits bat, enters and comes to rest in fair territory. PU verbalizes "foul ball". Of course, this is an oops, but can the error be rectified? Would it be possible to call a "no pitch"?

Live with the call.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by fredhjr

Batter moves in the box to avoid being hit by pitch. Ball hits bat, enters and comes to rest in fair territory. PU verbalizes "foul ball". Of course, this is an oops, but can the error be rectified? Would it be possible to call a "no pitch"?

Foul ball is unredeemable.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by MT 73

Live with the call.

And when the following conversation occurs:

Coach: Blue, that ball came off the bat and came to rest in fair territory.
Umpire: Yes, coach, I'm afraid it did
Coach: Yet, you called it a foul ball
Umpire: Yes, coach, I'm afraid I did
Coach: So this should be considered a fair batted ball, correct?
Umpire: Well, yes
Coach: So you know it is fair, but called foul?
Umpire: I'm afraid I did
Coach: Then I'm playing the game under protest

[Rich Ives]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

And when the following conversation occurs:

Coach: Blue, that ball came off the bat and came to rest in fair territory.
Umpire: Yes, coach, I'm afraid it did
Coach: Yet, you called it a foul ball
Umpire: Yes, coach, I'm afraid I did
Coach: So this should be considered a fair batted ball, correct?
Umpire: Well, yes
Coach: So you know it is fair, but called foul?
Umpire: I'm afraid I did
Coach: Then I'm playing the game under protest

Thanks coach, I'll note that and turn in the report.

Play!

[Andy]

Once the ball is called foul, that bell should not be unrung.....

The problem with this play is....how do you "fix" it? You can't assume that the defense would have pounced on the ball and made an out and you can't assume that the BR would have made it safely to first. No pitch is not an option.

It wasn't specified which rule set, but in NCAA, you CANNOT, by rule, change this to a fair ball.

Here is a play I had as a UIC from a few years ago....

ASA (at the time) rules, 3 umpire crew, no runners on, less than two strikes on the batter.

Pitch comes in, batter hits a ground ball to F5 playing in front of third base, ball rolls under F5's glove and goes foul prior to passing third base. PU rules foul ball. Offensive coach comes to PU and states that F5 touched the ball in fair territory and asks PU to check with his partners. PU gets crew together and U3 tells PU that the ball was touched in fair territory by F5. PU changes call to fair ball and placed the BR on first base. Defensive coach wants to protest, I am summoned to the field, get the story from the crew and talk to the defensive coach. I do not allow the protest since it was a reversal of a judgement call which is not subject to protest. Post game with crew was that PU should have told Offensive coach that he saw all he needed to and that the foul ball call stands.

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

And when the following conversation occurs:

Coach: Blue, that ball came off the bat and came to rest in fair territory.
Umpire: Yes, coach, I'm afraid it did
Coach: Yet, you called it a foul ball
Umpire: Yes, coach, I'm afraid I did
Coach: So this should be considered a fair batted ball, correct?
Umpire: Well, yes No, coach, my judgement at the time was a foul ball.
Coach: So you know it is fair, but called foul?
Umpire: I'm afraid I did
Coach: Then I'm playing the game under protest

Sorry, coach, but the judgment made at that moment cannot be protested; and the call stands.

Fixed that issue.

[robbie]

[QUOTE=Andy;1005296]Once the ball is called foul, that bell should not be unrung.....

The problem with this play is....how do you "fix" it? You can't assume that the defense would have pounced on the ball and made an out and you can't assume that the BR would have made it safely to first. No pitch is not an option.

It wasn't specified which rule set, but in NCAA, you CANNOT, by rule, change this to a fair ball.

Here is a play I had as a UIC from a few years ago....

ASA (at the time) rules, 3 umpire crew, no runners on, less than two strikes on the batter.

Pitch comes in, batter hits a ground ball to F5 playing in front of third base, ball rolls under F5's glove and goes foul prior to passing third base. PU rules foul ball. Offensive coach comes to PU and states that F5 touched the ball in fair territory and asks PU to check with his partners. PU gets crew together and U3 tells PU that the ball was touched in fair territory by F5. PU changes call to fair ball and placed the BR on first base. Defensive coach wants to protest, I am summoned to the field, get the story from the crew and talk to the defensive coach. I do not allow the protest since it was a reversal of a judgement call which is not subject to protest. Post game with crew was that PU should have told Offensive coach that he saw all he needed to and that the foul ball call stands.[/QUOTE]

Wrong - Wrong - and More Wrong......

[youngump]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

And when the following conversation occurs:

Coach: Blue, that ball came off the bat and came to rest in fair territory.
Umpire: Yes, coach, I'm afraid it did
Coach: Yet, you called it a foul ball
Umpire: Yes, coach, I'm afraid I did
Coach: So this should be considered a fair batted ball, correct?

Never had it happen but around here I've been told that this is how the rest of that goes.

Umpire: It should have been. It was incorrectly called foul
Coach: So you know it is fair, but called foul?
Umpire: I'm sorry but a ball inadvertently called foul must remain foul
Coach: Then I'm playing the game under protest
Umpire: Sure let me grab the UIC.
UIC: Protest denied.

And the citation is always about the impossibility of unringing a bell.

[MT 73]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

And when the following conversation occurs:

Coach: Blue, that ball came off the bat and came to rest in fair territory.
Umpire: Yes, coach, I'm afraid it did
Coach: Yet, you called it a foul ball
Umpire: Yes, coach, I'm afraid I did
Coach: So this should be considered a fair batted ball, correct?
Umpire: Well, yes
Coach: So you know it is fair, but called foul?
Umpire: I'm afraid I did
Coach: Then I'm playing the game under protest

No, that is your fantasy conversation.
If I say foul then in my judgement it is foul.
End of discussion.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by youngump

And the citation is always about the impossibility of unringing a bell.

This is certainly the case in NCAA play, where there is written guidance. But is there written guidance in the other sanctioning bodies?

I'm not suggesting that we change the call here on this play. But in the case where an umpire rules foul but everyone plays it as if it was fair (in other words, the umpire's call did not adversely affect the play), is that correctable in other organizations outside of NCAA? Just curious.

[MT 73]

Originally Posted by Manny A

This is certainly the case in NCAA play, where there is written guidance. But is there written guidance in the other sanctioning bodies?

I'm not suggesting that we change the call here on this play. But in the case where an umpire rules foul but everyone plays it as if it was fair (in other words, the umpire's call did not adversely affect the play), is that correctable in other organizations outside of NCAA? Just curious.

I have had that happen -- I do not umpire NCAA-- and I just let nature take it's course.
Play on.

[robbie]

Originally Posted by MT 73

I have had that happen -- I do not umpire NCAA-- and I just let nature take it's course.
Play on.

I have done that as well. As the mouth starts to say "foul" I realize it's not. Muffle the audible as best I can. Keep the arms down best I can. And move on hoping no one noticed.....

[Andy]

[QUOTE=robbie;1005298]

Originally Posted by Andy

Once the ball is called foul, that bell should not be unrung.....

The problem with this play is....how do you "fix" it? You can't assume that the defense would have pounced on the ball and made an out and you can't assume that the BR would have made it safely to first. No pitch is not an option.

It wasn't specified which rule set, but in NCAA, you CANNOT, by rule, change this to a fair ball.

Here is a play I had as a UIC from a few years ago....

ASA (at the time) rules, 3 umpire crew, no runners on, less than two strikes on the batter.

Pitch comes in, batter hits a ground ball to F5 playing in front of third base, ball rolls under F5's glove and goes foul prior to passing third base. PU rules foul ball. Offensive coach comes to PU and states that F5 touched the ball in fair territory and asks PU to check with his partners. PU gets crew together and U3 tells PU that the ball was touched in fair territory by F5. PU changes call to fair ball and placed the BR on first base. Defensive coach wants to protest, I am summoned to the field, get the story from the crew and talk to the defensive coach. I do not allow the protest since it was a reversal of a judgement call which is not subject to protest. Post game with crew was that PU should have told Offensive coach that he saw all he needed to and that the foul ball call stands.[/QUOTE]

Wrong - Wrong - and More Wrong......

Why?

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

Sorry, coach, but the judgment made at that moment cannot be protested; and the call stands.

Fixed that issue.

But as offered in the conversation, it was not a judgment call as the umpire admits the batted ball qualified as a fair ball.

Yes, maybe it was a brain fart, but I believe it to be a misinterpretation and that is protestable