World Cup - soccer image

[CecilOne]

Along with the weak performance of U.S.A. in the tournament, that match did more to destroy the image of soccer than any of the usual criticisms and nonsense comparisons to "American" sports.

In spite of being one of the better officiated matches of the tournament, the flaws always stand out. The dive PK, the illegal goal, and the PK that wasn't called (looking like a make-up), followed by the stupid head butt by someone who TV built up to be the image of soccer, were horrible.

Then compund that by deciding a world championship with a "fluke" missed PK and we lost years of progress.

[Nevadaref]

The US did not give a good performance against the Czech Rep. They did play a tremendous match with Italy, who has now demonstrated how strong they are. They were unlucky against Ghana and that side was better than people thought.


The final was truly unfortunate. If the Italy/Germany semi had been the final, soccer would have been better for it.

Yes, the PK given in the 7th min was a clear dive. Perhaps they will have to go to video replay to double check the awarding of penalty kicks and goals.

I don't know what you mean by "illegal goal." Zidane's PK did fully cross the goal line. Materazzi putting a hand on Vieira's shoulder while they were jumping was not a foul. Did the corner kick pass over the line and then curve back into the field prior to this goal? I haven't seen a replay that has a straight look down the goal line, so I can't say. Perhaps you are referring to Italy's disallowed goal in the 61st minute for being offside. They were. That call was correct.

The play in the 53rd minute would have been a decent one on which to award a penalty kick, but France had already had a undeserved one, so I can live with that decision. France got one out of the two and that was what was deserved.

Finally the headbutt was a disgrace.




There is no defending that. While taunts, pinches, etc. don't have any place in the game, they certainly don't warrant one losing control like that.
Despite winning the golden ball (MVP) award, he tarnished his legacy.

And yes kicks are no way to decide a champion. Something better must be found.

[CecilOne]

My illegal goal comment was about Materazzi. I'm not the only one who saw that as a foul, but either way, we are talking about image. Not about the CK either.
Yes, Italy was clearly offside in the 61st, good example of how offside allows scores if not caught.

[Antonella]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

My illegal goal comment was about Materazzi.

From this point on... I'm not sure we saw the SAME match!

Ciao

[Antonella]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

They (USA) did play a tremendous match with Italy...

Agree with this 100%.

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Yes, the PK given in the 7th min was a clear dive. Perhaps they will have to go to video replay to double check the awarding of penalty kicks and goals....

This is a great idea, an idea soccer fans in Italy and all over Europe support 101%. Ask Big Chief Blatter about it... and you will discover the top of technology in his mind is a pocket calculator...

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Finally the headbutt was a disgrace...

Italian supporters felt sorry for this, too. As fans we respect champions and Zizou is one of the greatest. He was probably under a huge pressure at that moment. There was a time in the 2nd half he asked to be substituted, but his coach (a horrible man, in my opinion) simply ignore him. That probably means he was exausted. And he reacted in the wrong (worst) way AGAINST Materazzi...

Ciao

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Antonella

From this point on... I'm not sure we saw the SAME match!

Ciao

Doesn't matter whether we all thought that was foul or not, my point is, because some did, about image, especially in the U.S.A..

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

My illegal goal comment was about Materazzi. I'm not the only one who saw that as a foul, but either way, we are talking about image.

Well, each person is entitled to his own opinion in this world. Here's the video clip, too bad that it isn't of better quality.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XARj5Jk31c4

Materazzi's right arm makes contact with the back/upper shoulders of Vieira, but he does not seem to push or displace him. In fact, Vieira moves backwards, not forward during the contest for the ball.

Lastly, please notice that not a single French player can be seen appealing for a foul. For me that's the deciding factor. The French players felt that it was a good goal.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

Doesn't matter whether we all thought that was foul or not, my point is, because some did, about image, especially in the U.S.A..

While I understand what you are saying about the image and popularity of the game in the US, your argument doesn't seem to lead to a logical conclusion.

If I understand the contention properly, it is that because some people felt that the referee team made a few mistakes in the Final, the image of soccer will suffer in the US and hence not be as popular.

I can only compare this to what happened in the NFL's Superbowl last year. Do you recall the much debated offensive pass interference call that negated a touchdown for Seattle early in the game? How was that penalty flag received in the US public? Is the NFL now going to be less popular? Will teams see a drop in attendence on Sunday's because of the officiating in the Superbowl?
I doubt it.

Rather it seems that a bit of controversy gives people something to discuss long after the game is over.
In the end, I don't believe that the France/Italy match hurt the development of the game in the US. Of course, it probably didn't help it either. I just can't say one way or the other for sure. All I know is that the sports bar where I watched the match was packed and the US wasn't playing.

[CecilOne]

Good comment, but no, it wasn't because the officials didn't always agree with us. I'll try to re-explain what I meant tomorrow.

[RonRef]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

Along with the weak performance of U.S.A. in the tournament, that match did more to destroy the image of soccer than any of the usual criticisms and nonsense comparisons to "American" sports.

In spite of being one of the better officiated matches of the tournament, the flaws always stand out. The dive PK, the illegal goal, and the PK that wasn't called (looking like a make-up), followed by the stupid head butt by someone who TV built up to be the image of soccer, were horrible.

Then compund that by deciding a world championship with a "fluke" missed PK and we lost years of progress.

I am not a true soccer fan and I don't officiate soccer, with that said, all I hear is what a great world sport soccer is then why the heck does every player take a dive every time the wind blows. Why don't they put more than one official in the middle of the field? 1 guy watching 22 players...impossible...that was very clear during the entire World Cup! They need to start throwing out yellow cards left and right for guys taking dives.

[gsf23]

Originally Posted by RonRef

I am not a true soccer fan and I don't officiate soccer, with that said, all I hear is what a great world sport soccer is then why the heck does every player take a dive every time the wind blows. Why don't they put more than one official in the middle of the field? 1 guy watching 22 players...impossible...that was very clear during the entire World Cup! They need to start throwing out yellow cards left and right for guys taking dives.

The diving is what drives me crazy the most about soccer. All these soccer people tell me that they give cards for diving, well, I watched 10 world cup matches this year and I didn't see a single card given for a dive.

[Antonella]

Originally Posted by gsf23

The diving is what drives me crazy the most about soccer.

I know what you mean...
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...urceid=igoogle

But I can say after a while you get used to it, like after a while I get used of baseball players spitting all over the playing field...

Ciao

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

While I understand what you are saying about the image and popularity of the game in the US, your argument doesn't seem to lead to a logical conclusion.

If I understand the contention properly, it is that because some people felt that the referee team made a few mistakes in the Final, the image of soccer will suffer in the US and hence not be as popular.

I can only compare this to what happened in the NFL's Superbowl last year. Do you recall the much debated offensive pass interference call that negated a touchdown for Seattle early in the game? How was that penalty flag received in the US public? Is the NFL now going to be less popular? Will teams see a drop in attendence on Sunday's because of the officiating in the Superbowl?
I doubt it.

Rather it seems that a bit of controversy gives people something to discuss long after the game is over.
In the end, I don't believe that the France/Italy match hurt the development of the game in the US. Of course, it probably didn't help it either. I just can't say one way or the other for sure. All I know is that the sports bar where I watched the match was packed and the US wasn't playing.

Not questioning the loyalty of true soccer fans.
Not questioning whether even the best refs miss a few, or even whether they did or not in this match.
Again, my comment is about image/perception. The damage to image for those who don't watch/participate in soccer routinely is immense if those people think the scoring in the final was determined by flukes. You and I and millions of others will continue to follow soccer, watch World Cup, etc. Soccer needs to win over more fans and this World Cup did not help. If you were a sports fan, not a strong soccer fan, and watched that match, it would make a more negative impression than positive. That is in spite of the spirited, skillful play through most of the match; but that is mainly appreciated by regular soccer fans, not the general sports fan or casual observer.
Of course, the other major pro and college sports in this country have an entrenched following, but that is what soccer needs to overcome.
Even the "glorious" NFL has to use video replays to confirm/deny the officials' calls and there are eight of them. Not that I like the VR idea, especially for soccer, but something is needed for goal judgeing. BTW, I have predicted that the MLS will beat out the NBA by 2030.