Helping the runner

[bigjohn]

2010 Point of Emphasis!

Pretty sure in these clips you can see
ASSISTING THE RUNNER
The NFHS Football Rules Committee develops competitive rules that promote fair play
and attempt to minimize risks to student-athletes. Fundamental to this process is the constant evaluation of the rules and how they impact the balance between offense and defense.
NFHS Rule 9-1 states: “An offensive player shall not push, pull or lift the runner to assist
his forward progress.” These acts, whether intentional or not, create an inequity between
the offensive and defensive teams and must be penalized without regard to down or field
position.
Pushing the pile forward has become more prominent at the high school level. This act
alone does not necessarily constitute a violation of Rule 9-1 unless an offensive player is in
direct contact with the runner and deliberately attempting to move him forward. Pulling or
lifting a runner to assist his forward progress has no place in high school football. The sole
reason these acts occur is to give the offensive team an advantage. Football officials are
expected to penalize such actions so the balance can be maintained.

[JRutledge]

All of that sounds great, but not once did I read or see an example that this POE applied to these plays shown in the OP.

And once again, you never have to make this call and if you did you would not be working very long. And you notice they did not go back to this POE after that year? I doubt much changed even in that year.

Peace

[Adam]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

All of that sounds great, but not once did I read or see an example that this POE applied to these plays shown in the OP.

And once again, you never have to make this call and if you did you would not be working very long. And you notice they did not go back to this POE after that year? I doubt much changed even in that year.

Peace

They probably dropped the POE for two reasons.

1. Some refs actually started making this call, and the coaches on the rule committee didn't like it.
2. The rest of the coaches saw the POE and spent all year yelling for that call.

[asdf]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

2010 Point of Emphasis!

Pretty sure in these clips you can see
ASSISTING THE RUNNER
The NFHS Football Rules Committee develops competitive rules that promote fair play
and attempt to minimize risks to student-athletes. Fundamental to this process is the constant evaluation of the rules and how they impact the balance between offense and defense.
NFHS Rule 9-1 states: “An offensive player shall not push, pull or lift the runner to assist
his forward progress.” These acts, whether intentional or not, create an inequity between
the offensive and defensive teams and must be penalized without regard to down or field
position.
Pushing the pile forward has become more prominent at the high school level. This act
alone does not necessarily constitute a violation of Rule 9-1 unless an offensive player is in
direct contact with the runner and deliberately attempting to move him forward. Pulling or
lifting a runner to assist his forward progress has no place in high school football. The sole
reason these acts occur is to give the offensive team an advantage. Football officials are
expected to penalize such actions so the balance can be maintained.

Highlighted the pertinent interpretation in red...



"Pushing the pile is not a foul"

The fact that you as a coach won't admit the fact that Ohio has (and has for a long, long time) interpreted it this way is disheartening on your part.

[Suudy]

Originally Posted by Welpe

I STILL think that at the time, the Bush Push should have been called. Not many (other than ND fans) agree with me.

I agree it should have been called, and I'm a Pac-12 guy (and _not_ a UCLA fan ).

[bigjohn]

Amanda Clearcreek and Ron Hinton would not agree with you at all.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Adam

They probably dropped the POE for two reasons.

1. Some refs actually started making this call, and the coaches on the rule committee didn't like it.
2. The rest of the coaches saw the POE and spent all year yelling for that call.

I think one of the big myths about POEs is that everyone is having the same problems. I am sure somewhere, someone had an issue an it was a POE. That does not mean the rest of us had the same issues or wanted this or any other POE to be called more.

If the NF wanted to outlaw this kind of play, they would have made sure it was in all their literature. And the fact that there is basically a disclaimer about pushing the pile tells me even more their intent was never to outlaw what we see on the first two videos. The last video, there is a reasonable debate to be had.

Peace

[asdf]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

Amanda Clearcreek and Ron Hinton would not agree with you at all.

What's that got to do with what the interpretation is? There's plenty of rules we don't agree with. Doesn't change the rule.

If he's a head coach, he should know (just like your head coach) since this matter is brought up annually.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

Amanda Clearcreek and Ron Hinton would not agree with you at all.

I'm sure Clearcreek's opponent and their coach would agree with us just fine. One school and one coach does not, an organization, make.

I suspect there are coaches and schools right now whose opponents benefitted from a particular rule, and whom do not agree with the rule right now. Doesn't make them right, and doesn't change the rule.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

Amanda Clearcreek and Ron Hinton would not agree with you at all.

OK, who are they? And why do I care what they have to say?

Do they give my crew games? NO.

Do we get playoffs based off of their recommendation? Hell NO!

I put this on the equivalence of what the ACC Supervisor said about an issue in the off season and then the Supervisor of NCAA Officials not only disagreed, but gave evidence of why it was not what the ACC Supervisor claimed was illegal (without using his name).

I do not have to answer to either of these two. And if I called what was suggested in the video, I would not be working very much, if at all.

Peace

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by bisonlj

NCAA rule changed last year removing a push as an act that constitutes assisting the runner. If this happened this year there is no question it is NOT a foul.

"Last year" would be 2012, and I assure you the word "push" still appears in the 2012 NCAA 9-3-2(b). Did you mean 2013?

[HLin NC]

Amanda Clearcreek and Ron Hinton would not agree with you at all.

"Nevah heard of 'em"- props to the QCB on WFNZ

[bigjohn]

It is an Ohio thing, Ron is a big Boy and he threw a fit when HTR was called on his team in the state finals, over ten years ago.

It is hilarious if you saw it! He made a spectecal of himself and got a 2 or 3 game suspension!




Each of the clips show this!
offensive player is in
direct contact with the runner and deliberately attempting to move him forward

[CT1]

From the replies thus far, I don't think you'll have to worry about having this called for or against you, John.

Well, maybe against.

[asdf]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

Each of the clips show this!
offensive player is in
direct contact with the runner and deliberately attempting to move him forward

And according to interpretation in Ohio, if the runner is part of a pile it's legal.

Do you deny that the powers that be in Ohio have said that pushing the pile is legal?