End of Wisconsin - Arizona State game
 

No video to post yet, but it should be the biggest story in college football from the weekend.

Someone explain to me how any official on that field ever gets work again.

Couple things at play. If you put the ball down, you are not down by rule.

Secondly, if the ball is downed, then you do not get to "clock" the ball with less then 3 seconds while the clock is running (New rule).

Either way, justice was done.

Full discloser, my mom went to Wisconsin and I am kind of a fan when they are not playing my first love (Michigan). The Wisconsin QB should be shot for stupidity.

Peace

So no answer then?



The play was over with 15 seconds left when it was blown dead. An Arizona State player laid on top of the ball with 12 seconds left for eight seconds followed by the official refusing to spot the ball.

Justify them ever working again.

http://twitpic.com/ddk0v6

His knee also does appear to be down, supported by the play being blown dead at that point by the officials.

<script src="http://player.espn.com/player.js?playerBrandingId=4ef8000cbaf34c1687a7d9a 26fe0e89e&adSetCode=91cDU6NuXTGKz3OdjOxFdAgJVtQcKJ nI&pcode=1kNG061cgaoolOncv54OAO1ceO-I&width=576&height=324&externalId=espn:9676858&thr uParam_espn-ui[autoPlay]=false&thruParam_espn-ui[playRelatedExternally]=true"></script>

As to your question, why is this a fireable offense in your opinion? If the conference deems they didn't follow the proper mechanics, there are other methods of punishment rather than outright firing, for one play.

Other than the infamous Oklahoma-Oregon onside kick game, I think you'd be hard-pressed to find a more massive failure in game officiating.

They failed with an official standing on top of the ball to spot it in 14 seconds.

They failed to throw a delay of game flag when a defensive player laid on the ball for 8 seconds.

They just ran off the field as if nothing had happened.

They failed miserably in every aspect of their job. It's not like there was a split-second judgment involved. This involved failure on the entire crew's part.

There's nothing that can be said to defend any of it.



Obviously I'm not expecting them to actually be fired, but if ever an official was going to lose his/her job for on-field performance, this would be it.

The defender was on top of the ball for that period of time because he, among with the entire defense, and I'm betting the umpire thought the QB fumbled the ball. The resulting confusion as to what happened on the play meant the defense wasn't going to get a DOG penalty on that play.

The play was blown dead with 15 seconds left on the clock. 10 seconds later the defender was finally letting go of the ball. That's way too long to be accepted as mere "confusion."

The very least they should have done would have been to review the play and spot the ball properly with the correct amount of time on the clock.

Wisconsin being denied a game-winning field goal opportunity, whether it from the 15 or the 10 after a DOG penalty, is 100% on the officials, and there's nothing that can be said to change that.

http://www.sbnation.com/2013/9/15/47...te-officiating


Another good summary.

Going to reserve judgment until I see video, but if your argument hinges on summaries from fan sites and an inconclusive still picture, you're not going to convince anyone here.

My take on it
 

I went to bed confused, last night, as to why the QB would think that setting the ball on the ground constituted giving himself up. Not until I saw the rear angle of the play could I actually tell that he did, in fact, down the ball. Whether he did or not is really a moot point, because the ref blew the whistle. To me, the officiating crew seemed completely unaware of the time left, as there was no urgency to retrieve the ball and set it for play. Watch the umpire's actions and body language after the whistle. While casually asking for the ball, he stopped and chatted with another Arizona lineman. Then he raised his hand and made the offensive line wait. Is there any way that they could have stopped and conferred instead of dashing off the field, to make sure they got it right?

I'll be interested to see what you have to say after you see it, because I don't think there's much room for interpretation.

Here's the video:

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I gave you an answer, but I have no idea what point you are trying to make.

Fanboy rants often do not work here.

Peace

The officials blew the play dead when A put the ball on the ground. A couple of seconds later, B jumps on the ball and covers it.

If the play had not ended so unusually, would you have allowed B to cover the ball and lay on it, especially given the game situation? Does the unusual end of the play give B more latitude to take advantage of the situation?

I've refuted every point you made. The officials correctly ruled that Stave took a knee. That happened with 15 seconds left. They then allowed a defensive player to lay on the ball for 7 seconds. They should have flagged him for delay of game, or at the very least stopped the clock to end the confusion. Wisconsin was at the line to spike the ball with 10+ seconds on the clock, so your three second rule doesn't apply either.

It's not a fan boy rant. It's what happened. The officials failed in every aspect of their job. They may as well have been out in the parking lot.

If you're not outraged, you're not understanding what took place.

They had ample opportunity to fix their errors, and instead they just jogged off the field.

This was not a good game for the crew all around. Missing a spot by four feet and a phantom USC somehow got trumped by the debacle of the last play.

Outraged by what? A player that does not know how to down the ball?

I have never seen a player do something so silly before. So what am I supposed to be upset by? I am sure the crew never saw such a silly player act as well.

Sorry it is just another Saturday from my point of view.

You keep talking about what the crew did not do but I have not heard what they should have done from your point of view.

Maybe then I might get outraged, but I doubt it.

Peace

Or some of us really don't give a rat's rear end. If it bothers you that badly, call the Big Whatever and fuss at them.

How can I possibly be more clear?

Stave took the knee with 15 seconds left. The pay wad immediately whistled dead. Stave went back to the line to snap the ball to spike it to stop the clock, but was unable to do so because the officials let an ASU player lay on the ball for 7 seconds. The officials at that point should have either flagged ASU for delay of game or simply stopped the clock to properly spot it.

All of this could have been fixed, but the officials were in too big of a hurry to get off the field instead of doing their jobs.

No guarantee that Wisconsin makes the field goal, but it's nothing short of a total screwjob that they were denied the opportunity.

So, how much did you lose on this game? ;)

Nothing. It's just the worst bit of officiating I've seen in years.

I can't see the video, but if he set the ball on the ground simultaneously with taking a knee, probably it was because he thought he'd get the officials to make the ball RFP sooner if he put it down for them.

I do not know what letting 15 seconds as you say has to do with getting off the field. If the time went off that much, then they should have stopped the clock. But when the next play is run you cannot go back and fix that, which is why I put this on the QB for his actions. He did something so unusual, it took everyone a few seconds to figure it out. And I did not say that the officials could not have handled it better, but they certainly had a player do something so silly. If anything it should have been a fumble and the game was over as ASU would have had the ball. But the officials blew the whistle so that ended that possiblity. If anything this is on Wisconsin IMO. And I do not find outrage in something they created or did not teach properly. At some point players have to know the rules and leave no doubt for the officials. Because the situation was so unusal, this put the officials in a spot where they would have made no one happy. Becaues if they stopped the clock like you say, then Wisconsin gets time to kick a FG which would have ended in controversy as well. Sorry, no sympathy for Wisconsin on this one.

I understand exactly what you are saying, I just do not agree with you. I do not see this as a travesty or something the officials are responsible for. Sorry, I saw the play and was like WTF is the QB doing?

Peace

He did not take a knee, the QB just put the ball on the ground while standing up. ASU treated it like a fumble and rightfully jumped all the ball. But that was not necessarily on the officials, that was on the Wisconsin player.

Peace

You missed the part where he took a knee. That was the point the play was blown dead. That's why I'm saying 7 seconds is way too long to let a "confused" player lay on the ball. The play was clearly and correctly called a kneel down.

The sun has risen and set since this happened. I'm sure if the powers that be determine that sanctions are warranted, they will be administered.

In he end, if your kicker can't hit a 33 yard field goal from the right hash, your 20th ranked team has more issues than a QB screwing up.

Sorry, but I don't really see the problem (personally, I don't really like either team), other than the fact that the whistle blew prematurely. I would have called this a fumble. NOW, if they want to rule him down here based on intent to take a knee, that's fine, but the actions of the defense by getting on the ball are reasonable. I've been watching football my entire life - over 40 years and I've never, ever seen a QB do anything like that. There's no way in hell I'm flagging the D for jumping on the ball, and if I ruled it down we will get it ready as soon as possible. In this case, the QB doesn't know how to take a knee and that's their problem, not the officials'.

Had this happened when time was not a factor, no one would have even remembered it. I don't know why the U held the play up but if his explanation is even remotely reasonable, there's NO officiating problem here.

You can't do something strange and expect the officials to behave as if you did something everyone sees at every game.

I do not see a knee being taken, I see a player going down, but not put their knee on the ground but placed the ball on the ground. Which if that is the case that is normally a fumble and why the ASU players reacted.

And if they did not want the confusion, why even run a play there. Stupid still. Your kicker should be able to kick the ball from anywhere and you would give them a chance. Getting the ball to the middle obviously did not work and caused more confusion with the way the QB "squatted."

Sorry, still not outraged.

Peace

You'd be hard pressed to find a more stupid comment on here. Even if this was a failure it was not massive and was 100% created by the white QB.

If you want to discuss what the U was doing, and do so rationally, fine. Otherwise, your rhetoric here is pure hyperbole.

I have discussed it rationally. The call on the field was correctly that of the play ending on a kneeldown. The QB knelt down with the ball. His knee clearly touched the ground. That's the way the officials called it on the field.

I understand where the confusion comes from, but there's a line between some confusion and allowing the defense to run off the remainder of the clock by laying on top of a ball that should be being spotted for play.

It doesn't take seven seconds to tell a player to get the hell off the ball so I can spot it. It should have resulted in a penalty for delay of game because the way it played out rewarded the defense for holding the ball hostage.

Centering the ball makes sense given that they don't have the best kicker in the world. They had plenty of time to do it. They were lined up to spike the ball to stop the clock with more than 10 seconds to go. The only reason it "failed" is because the officials failed in their duties.



To be honest, I wouldn't be anywhere near as upset by the whole situation if the officials had made any effort at all to correct it. They just ran off the field without even offering an explanation to the Wisconsin coach. That's what's most unacceptable to me.

Did you not watch APG's video?

The whitehat talked to the Wisconsin coach after the game.

He didn't offer any real explanation. At least not one that's been shared by anyone.

I guess what I would have liked to have seen happen would be a review to determine that the kneeldown was properly executed followed by the ball being spotted for play with the clock situation fixed.

I understand that seems like you're giving an advantage to the offense, but there was plenty of time on the clock, and it was the defense's actions that caused the clock to run out, and they shouldn't be allowed to benefit that way.

And how do you know what the WH said?

Thank you for being a fan of college football.

You do not have a clue what what explanation was given or if it was satisfactory. Even if the coach shared what he was told, that does not mean it would not be incomplete.

And you also sound like a fanboy. For one if they did a review, the other side would be highly upset if Wisconsin could set up and kick a successful field goal. There was time enough to "clock" the ball and be able to kick the ball but from the right hash and the clock would have been stopped. And if you cannot do that, then you need a better kicker from that distance if getting the ball in the middle is so important. I would think kickers practice enough from different angles. You are in the Big Ten for God's sake, not Division 3.

Again, still not outraged based on your information.

Peace

None of that is relevant. It's good strategy to set up an easier kick. The ONLY reason it "failed" is because the officials let ASU hold the ball hostage without consequence.

Actually it is relevant. When you do unusual things, you have to expect that the officials are going to handle it properly. That is why officials ask before the game, "Do you have any unusual plays we need to officiating?" Of course this is not one of those plays that will be discussed, but if you do something no one has seen or you did not coach properly, then same on you. Why would the QB not down the ball, then keep the ball in his hand and give it to the official? I know that want to move fast all the time hand the ball to the officials immediately after they are tackled or downed. Sorry, this is all relevant if you want an opportunity to do what you want to do with a kick. And Wisconsin of all places had a rules change based off of their actions in the Rose Bowl. Shame on them for being so unprepared.

Peace

I would say it was the officials who were unprepared. Wisconsin was at the line and ready to play.

The officials then proceeded to run off the field instead of fixing their own errors. The officials might as well have been in their cars in the parking lot as the last 15 seconds ticked off the clock. That's what's unacceptable. That's why they deserve to be suspended.

Once again, every official here has said this was an unusual way to run a play. I would agree the officials were unprepared for such a stupid play to be run. And yes they could have done things better, but Wisconsin could have helped. They choose to run a dumb play that allowed confusion. Running a play to get in the middle is stupid and always has been. Maybe now teams will just kick the ball form where they are and move on.

Peace

Apparently you know all about being prepared as an official. How many games have you worked at the FBS level, D2 level, D3 level, High School level, or peewee level?

They let an ASU player hold the ball hostage for 7 seconds on the ground without consequence. There is nothing else to be said.

Thought so.....

You can't explain away my issue so you change the subject?

Can we lock this thing before the p!$$ fight really starts?:rolleyes:

I gave you my position.

The powers that be will take care of it if they deem necessary.
The sun is still rising and setting.
Your team gave up almost 500 yards of offense.
Your team gave up 32 points.
You aren't getting any sympathy from many on here.
You'll continue to whine about it.

I'm done

I'd have been done awhile ago if people didn't keep making the same incorrect arguments to defend the indefensible.

Actually people here do not care either way. I am only in this conversation because it is entertaining.

Peace

1. It was an epically stupid play for the QB.
2. The video is completely inconclusive on whether or not his knee was down.
3. The R points down, but he seems to be the only one besides the QB who thought the QB was down.
4. The R seems to be trying to tell the U to put the ball down.
5. The U should have killed the clock if he thought B had recovered a fumble.
6. The U doesn't seem to know what the play result was.
7. By the time the U puts the ball down, there is not enough time to spike ball successfully.
8. What an idiotic play by the QB.

Not even close, IMO.

What consequence? It was a loose ball, and the ASU player reasonably thought it was a fumble. What punishment do you suggest? There's no rule that allows the clock to be stopped if this wasn't an actual fumble, though, so I'm honestly not sure what the officials should have done.

Whatever hbk thinks, I guess.

Seven seconds is well beyond a reasonable amount of time to release the ball. Should have been a defensive delay of game penalty.

And all caused by the stupid actions of Wisconsin and their QB.

Peace

Let's remember that opinions on the "stupidity" of this play (or the OP being a "fanboy") should be irrelevant to the discussion of the officiating of this play.

You have not been here very long have you?

Peace

Let's Be Clear About the End of the UW-ASU Game - Off Tackle Empire


http://www.offtackleempire.com/2013/...hdown-seahawks

This is where the relevance of whether you (or I) have ever worked FBS football comes into play. Given that there may have been confusion on the part of the ASU players whether it was a fumble (there seems to have been confusion from the umpire), I highly doubt NCAA supervisors want a flag on that.

But again, I don't work that level of football, and I have no access to the instructions they've been given on when to throw the DOG flag for this action and when they're supposed to give the player the benefit of the doubt.

Disagree, in so far as the stupidity of the play has an effect on how the officials can be expected to respond.

Actually, this isn't quite right. The spike rule is only in effect if the clock is stopped (usually because of a first down) and is going to be started on the RFP.

But that's completely irrelevant to this play.

All I know is that I picked a great time to fly to England and avoid all the sportswriters in Madison who have made me realize that sports journalism is dead and has been completely replaced with opinion stories written by unabashed homers.

Oh, and I also got to miss the local CBS station calling me and asking me for comment, of which I have none, of course.

I still can't look at video from this computer, but if the description and series of stills at the link above is anything other than out-and-out lies, the umpire threw the game to team B. Clearly the action by the player who had taken a knee with the ball was to try to get the ball readied for play sooner. Here, I'm spotting it for you. So don't blame him, that's about the most cooperative you could ever expect the ballcarrier to be when the whistle blows. (My players always want to take the ball into the huddle with them!) How could he possibly anticipate the officials would then allow the other team to futz around with the ball, and leave the clock running while doing so?

Not only that, but in the stills subsequent to the one above, the players of the team in black, other than those who dove on the ball, clearly acted as if the ball was dead.

This was the first response, with no video and only seeing a brief highlight before the later in the night. Of course it was irrelevant as it is not what happened on the play.

Peace

Shouldn't officials be prepared to officiate any play that comes up in their games, regardless of how "stupid" they think it is?

I think you are missing the point. The team that wants the officials to put the ball in play quickly, does something that caused confusion. If the Wisconsin player wanted to take a knee, hold on to the damn football so that you can give it to the nearest official. Then no one thinks there is a fumble. No one can take the ball away from being put in play. This is why teams in the hurry up style are now getting tackled and instead of celebrating or doing something silly, they take the football to the nearest official. Why? Because they want the ball put back in play ASAP. What the QB should have done is hand the ball to the Umpire, instead of setting it down where anything could have happened to it. And this has been taught for years in hurry up situations long before the Spread or Oregon played this fast paced offense. So when you set the ball down where and official has run and get the ball behind your lineman, yes that was stupid. It is stupid because they are the ones that wanted the ball to be put in play quickly and when you would not do that any other time in that situation and now complain the ball was not put back in play.

Peace

What is it everyone tells me, still photos are worthless!!!!:):):):):):)

To call fouls. Yes they are worthless. This is not a foul.

Peace

Wow. I'm embarrassed. Embarrassed that the officials on this site seem to be 100% in defense of the actions by this crew. Fanboy or not, the OP is correct. Stupidly executed play by the QB no doubt - but surely we're not forgiving the crew on this play simply because the player's form was not perfect. Good grief, people.

The worst part, to me, was the umpire standing up having a conversation with a defensive lineman while precious seconds fade away. There is no question the crew needs to be more aware of the clock than this crew was.

So, that said, has anyone heard if there was any disciplinary action taken?

(PS - most definitely NOT the worst I've ever seen. Oregon vs OU had 2 or 3 plays alone that top this. Both 5th down plays. Nebr-Mich failed Stanforesque ending ... all of these were far worse.)

Yes.

But are you going to be happy with anything less than them never working again?

They probably got downgraded and maybe the Umpire and possibly the Referee could have been involved.

The BIG suspended a crew for messing up a 10 second run off near the end of the first half that involved and injured player and an incomplete pass.

These guys appear to be working.

Still not outraged. ;)

Peace

I'm happy to see that the conference is stating what everyone already knew instead of burying its head in the sand.

I'd be interested to know what exactly the sanctions include, because the conference's statement doesn't really reflect the magnitude of the officials' errors.

Because they probably are going to officiate next week and the rest of the season unless another incident. And something tells me they will be back next year too. And in the situation where I said a BIG crew was suspended, the media never covered the specific incident in any capacity until the officials were suspended. Even then it was not even a big deal because the media has no idea what officials are scrutinized for but when it is a well known incident near the end of the game.

The statement sounds mostly for PR purposes to make people like you feel better. Nothing more and nothing less.

The incident will be used for training and to help communication, but nothing more will be done.

For the record officials in every conference are evaluated on every play and down graded all the time for stuff you never even know took place or for a coverage that seemed routine. But as a fanboy you probably did not know that fact.

Peace

It might be that they disagree with you on the magnitude.

It might be they don't think the public needs to know, because publicizing sancctions would undermine the credibility of this crew in future games.

Based on your initial post, which was really the spark of disagreement here, I didn't think you'd be happy unless they were deported to North Korea.

My thoughts exactly. Not only were they reprimanded by their own conference supervisor, but the Big 10 supervisor of officials is on record saying they did not handle the situation correctly.

Many times in a inter-conference game like this one, the on-officials come from the visiting team's conference, while the replay official comes from the home team's conference.

I know that wasn't the case here and that the on-field officials were from the Pac 12. My question is, what conference was the replay official from? If he is from the Big 10, will he receive any sanctions from that conference?

Obviously I was over the top in my initial post, but the officials did decide the game through their errors and made no attempt to correct them.

What's done is done. Hopefully this inexcusable situation doesn't happen again. I'd just like to see some of you be a little more objective looking at the situation. MD Longhorn was exactly right.

And for the record, I'm normally defensive of officials, especially in baseball with all of the "analysts" commenting on umpires, but as someone who watched this situation happen live and watched the officials abandon their posts at the end of the game, the officials deserve every bit of criticism they received.

Just because people do not agree with you does not make it less objective. Once again the team created the situation by their actions. Hand the ball to the officials and no ASU player can jump on the ball or assume it was a fumble. I guarantee you teams will coach this part of the game better and not have their player set the ball down on the ground, waiting for the ball to be spotted by the officials.

Peace

This is not a replay situation. The clock was not stopped and should not have been stopped unless some penalty or other action (which I am still trying to figure out what action could have been taken) was taken.

Peace

If you've spend more than one second on this site, you would know that one of the major pet peeves of officials (of all sports, btw) is this notion that an error on one play, even a big one, decides the game every single time it happens at the end of the game. The notion is nonsense. EVERY play could decide the game. The game is the confluence of all the plays (and mistakes, outstanding plays, bad and good calls) put together.

Speaking as if the notion carries any weight at all is going to get your POV dismissed quickly and decisively, even if (as in this case) you had a valid point otherwise.

I dismissed this notion the first time someone brought it up, but now I have to ask. What in the world could you possibly fault the replay official for? The replay official had no input whatsoever on this play.

While that would have helped, it's a total cop out to use that to attempt to defend the officials lack of officiating.

HBK:

I am sure you realize by now that half of the guys on this site are merely apologists for officials. You are right. Guys in leadership positions all over the country agree with you. The officials erred by either (1) blowing an inadvertent whistle, or, (2) failing to set the ball or call a foul on ASU for delay, and (3) having the Umpire "hold" the snapper when no substitution occurred.

The stupidity of the Wisconsin QB in trying to center the ball does not relieve these officials from officiating the play correctly.

They made mistake(s) in a chaotic situation. I also don't think it warrants firing them.

I'm confused as to what question you are really asking.

Not (1) - he clearly (in one angle at least, and that angle most closely mirrors R's angle) took a knee. But definitely (2) and (3), and I agree with you that player stupidity doesn't make it OK that the officials booted this one.

If you have been paying attention, I said everyone had a role. But it was all started by the team that ran a stupid play that they did not need to run and their QB did something no one I have ever seen do such a thing. And once again, I am a BIG fan and a Wisconsin supporter. I think the play was silly and if anyone they need to blame is what they told their QB to do. Honestly the officials are last on the list of blame.

Peace

I hear a whistle with 0:14 on the clock but there is no official near the ball. Still would have taken time for the appropriate official to come mark the spot and then get back into position.

The officials didn't handle the situation correctly but it's not like they did something egregious. I'm still trying to figure out what the OP is expecting someone here to say in response to his statements.

No one here offered any apologetics for the officials. That's ridiculous, frankly. All that was offered was a sort of mitigation from the initial claim that these guys should be fired. IOW, "yeah they screwed up, but get a grip."

I'd be curious to find out what the prescribed remedy would have been here. The R should have been a bit more adamant about the situation. I don't see any possibility of flagging the defense here, and I doubt that's the prescription. In order to justify that, the U would have needed to ask for the ball, right? I could be wrong on this, though.

No one said it made it ok. Only that it explains it. And that it was avoidable for the players. IOW, don't do something weird that might confuse the refs, even at that level.
Oh, and we objected to the inital (and repeated) claims that they should never work again.

If there is nothing to be said why did you ask for responses? I'm still confused as to your goal for posting. I've yet to see you state that this is something you pregame with your crew to make sure you handle end of game situations correctly.

Here is the thing, they do not have an answer. You noticed they did not tell the Umpire to throw the offensive lineman out of the way or to figure out why the Wisconsin team with plenty of time (according to the OP) did not just kick a FG from the right hash. I have given more solutions to the situation then this guy.

Something tells me that no team in the country will instruct their QB to put the ball on the ground again. ;)

Peace

If the officials were so confused by the play, they need to stop the clock to get things sorted out. Even after the clock hit zero, there was ample opportunity to talk it out and fix it.

The one thing that can't happen is what they let happen. The umpire was standing there socializing instead of spotting the ball for play. If he thought ASU had a right to the ball, the clock should have been stopped for change of possession. There's no excuse whatsoever for him letting the ASU player lay on the ball for 7 seconds with the clock still running. That's a delay of game.

The officials denied Wisconsin an OPPORTUNITY to win the game, effectively taking the game out of the hands of the players and deciding it themselves.

Actually, I don't think flagging the defense for laying on the ball once the umpire told him to get off would have been inappropriate. Of course, this would have required some awareness of the clock on the umpire's part - something that was clearly not there since he felt it was a great opportunity to chat up the other defensive player rather than getting the ball.

It's not always possible to read what Jeff really does mean ... but several of his comments came across (to me at least) as saying the QB's idiocy DID make it OK that the officials screwed it up. I do too. Right with you on that one.

Then if they do what you suggested and Wisconsin "clocks" the ball, and ASU fan on this site will claim the officials gave Wisconsin the game to set up field goal. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Wisconsin denied their chance to win the game. Kick the ball from the hash. If you cannot recruit a kicker to do that from HS (which has a wider angle from the hash) from that short distance, you do not deserve to win. Sorry, but it would have been easy to try a kick rather then trying to be cute. You are not going to change my mind on that point of view. They did not have to run another play to get the ball to the middle.

Peace

You're not an official. We get that. But after being told this twelve ways to Sunday - what you're proscribing was NOT an option. If they had done as you suggested, they'd have done something equally as bad as what they actually did - only the victim of that screw up would have changed.

Here's where I completely agree with you.

And again ... this is no better than what you said before. Don't go there - you lose all credibility and your point goes out the window as this incorrect concept draws all the attention. PS - they HAD an opportunity to win the game. They chose to run a play instead and bad stuff happened.

Put it this way... Wisconsin chose to take a risk by running a play - not a big risk, but a risk. Something that should have worked 99% of the time, and increased their chances of making the field goal marginally. Unfortunately, they then rolled double-zeros.

Instead they rewarded ASU for laying on a dead ball for seven seconds preventing it from being spotted.

Your second paragraph has no relevance. There's no grey area here. The officials were completely in the wrong, and it denied Wisconsin an opportunity to attempt a game winning field goal.

Trying so hard to help you here.... but now I'm out. You don't get it and don't want to get it.

I understand what you're saying, and if it had been a Wisconsin error that cost them, I'd agree with you.

It cannot be disputed that the officials mishandling of the situation cost Wisconsin a chance to win the game. Wisconsin may have missed the field goal in the end, but they didn't get the chance to attempt it.