KO Mechanic, Ball Placement

[ppaltice]

On a Kick Off, if K brings out a tee does the ball need to be on the tee prior to the RFP? Can K be holding the ball prior to RFP? Or does the ball need to be in the final position (either on the ground, on a tee, or holder holding the ball) before the RFP?

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by ppaltice

On a Kick Off, if K brings out a tee does the ball need to be on the tee prior to the RFP? Can K be holding the ball prior to RFP? Or does the ball need to be in the final position (either on the ground, on a tee, or holder holding the ball) before the RFP?

I can't imagine a Referee giving the RFP signal, prior to the ball being in place to actually start the play, so your questions seems mute. Normally (if not always) a Referee will make sure each of his fellow officials is set and ready to go and the kicker is set, and ready to kick, BEFORE giving the RFP signal.

Should the ball blow off the tee, or something else interrupt the sequence, the usual procedure is to stop everything, correct the problem, recheck that everyone is again ready to start, THEN gice another RFP signal and off we go.

[BktBallRef]

To my knowledge, the rules do not address this situation.

[jemiller]

Many times...like every week. We have teams that huddle up before getting ready for the KO. Some times they will try to do an onside formation from the huddle and catch the receivers sleeping. We give the ball to the kicker and instruct him to wait for the WH's whistle. They put it on the tee sometimes right away and sometimes with a delay. Regardless they do their thing, and we do ours. The kicker always appears to have the ball on the tee when I blow the whistle, but not always. If the wing officials signal that they are ready the RFP will be sounded. Jim

[ajmc]

Why would a wing official EVER signal he was ready if the ball is not on the Tee?

[w_sohl]

Originally Posted by ajmc

Why would a wing official EVER signal he was ready if the ball is not on the Tee?

Who says they need to kick from a tee? Had a game this last Friday and the home team liked to set the ball NEXT to the tee and run up to it like they were going to kick it onside, only to stop and reset for a deep kick. As soon as I am in position I am signalling that "I" am ready. Then the kicking team has 25 seconds to kick the ball. I don't care what they do with that 25 seconds.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by ajmc

Why would a wing official EVER signal he was ready if the ball is not on the Tee?

There's a 1 minute break between the try and the kickoff. At the 45 second mark, we are getting the teams out of their huddle and back on the field. At 1 minute, the R chops everyone in and blows the RFP. It makes no difference whether the ball is on the tee or not.

Last year, we had two delay of game penalties on a JV team in the same game. First time i've ever seen it but we're not waiting all night.

If this is wrong, please provide rule reference, case play or NFHS interpretation. I'm not interested in you opinion. Give us proof.

[whitehat]

On numerous occassions in my experience a kicker will place the ball on the ground next to the tee, go back and line up, raise his hand and just wait. As R I blow the RFP.Soemtimes the team rushes the ball and then they suddenly stop, then the kicker puts it on the tee, they back up and then have a normal KO. other times they all rush the ball and the kicker kicks it off the ground in a squib or onside manner...

another variable sometimes is the Kicking team is simply taking too long...they are slow, going through their routine.....I blow the RFP and they decide oh, we better actually get busy and kick this thing.

Along the same lines as a coach who simply will not leave the offensive huddle after his timeout is over. I have been known to blow the RFP after several warnings that the timeout is over and the coach has to hustle to get off the field....usually only takes once.

[ppaltice]

Did some checking. According to Redding's guide (pg 58) which is citing 2001 NFHS interpretations: 'Adjusting the ball on the tee or moving it from the ground to an adjacent tee is not considered changing the designated spot (2001 interp, Sit 15).' So it appears you can blow the ball RFP when the ball is on the ground by the tee and the kicking team can move the ball from the ground to the tee.

Originally Posted by ajmc

I can't imagine a Referee giving the RFP signal, prior to the ball being in place to actually start the play, so your questions seems mute.

Pet peeve: the correct word is 'moot' not 'mute.'

[jaybird]

Originally Posted by ajmc

Why would a wing official EVER signal he was ready if the ball is not on the Tee?

Because the ball does not have to be on a tee and has nothing to do with the official being ready.

[jaybird]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

There's a 1 minute break between the try and the kickoff. At the 45 second mark, we are getting the teams out of their huddle and back on the field. At 1 minute, the R chops everyone in and blows the RFP. It makes no difference whether the ball is on the tee or not.

Precisely!

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by jaybird

Because the ball does not have to be on a tee and has nothing to do with the official being ready.

Maybe if you "chose" to insist the play be ready to start before declaring you were ready, you'd eliminate the possibility of some silliness. Just a thought.

[golfnref]

Originally Posted by ajmc

Maybe if you "chose" to insist the play be ready to start before declaring you were ready, you'd eliminate the possibility of some silliness. Just a thought.

Typical ajmc. Attempting to belittle a post and have the last word with "silly" sarcasm.

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by golfnref

Typical ajmc. Attempting to belittle a post and have the last word with "silly" sarcasm.

The "silliness" I was referring to was that which might be attempted by a team who was reluctant to place the ball on a tee, or otherwise ready to begin play. Could it be that your aversion to sarcasim is just a tad slective?

[kfo9494]

I had a little situation this year come up concerning this situation. The kicking team was one that lined up with the ball on the ground and waited on the ready for play before the kicker approached the ball (like a on-side kick siutation) then stopped and placed ball on the tee.
As the kicker was backing up the ball fell off the tee.
Now this was a night with no wind causing any problems.
The 25 sec clock ran out, before he could reset and kick the ball, and a delay-of-game was called on the kicking team.
The coach made a show of the penalty to the point of calling time out and wanting to talk with me. Said that if the kicker, even with no wind, was approaching the ball and the ball, fell off the tee, then we should stop play. He said he has seen it a hundred times.
What is the difference?
>
He still got his 5 yard penalty.
Should we have stopped play and reset the 25 sec clock?