Scrimmage Kick/Momentum

[Jaysef]

During JV game last night, a punt rolled to the 3yl, where R picked it up, and his momentum took him into the EZ. Our BJ immediately blew play dead, and signalled a TB. I felt something was wrong with this, but kept it for post game discussion, since no coaches went ape over this. We spotted it at the 20yl and game continued.

In the interest of judicious officiating, should I have made sure the ball was spotted at the R's 3yl (momentum?), since play stopped, and the ball did technically become dead in R's EZ?

OR, was my BJ correct, since 8.5.3.a.1. ...any free kick, or scrimmage kick, which is not a scoring attempt...breaks the plane of Rs goal line...is a touchback.

Confused Umpire

[Sonofanump]

If possesion secured, IW. The player borught the ball into the EZ, not the kick. I think that we would have to give R the option of taking at the 3 or re-kick.

If no possesion, muff then touchback.

[AndrewMcCarthy]

Remember- the kick ends when the ball is possessed.

You had an IW when the ball was in player possession. The team in possession can take the ball at that spot (he had it in the EZ but the spot would be the momentum spot) or choose to replay the down.

Interesting that here's a play where the crew screws up and nobody complains but if you would have gotten it right the coach of the receivers would have gone ape when he got the ball at the 3.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by AndrewMcCarthy

Interesting that here's a play where the crew screws up and nobody complains but if you would have gotten it right the coach of the receivers would have gone ape when he got the ball at the 3.

Andrew, are you suggesting that coaches do not know the rules?

This is why it is so important to not be in such a hurry to blow the whistle. A BJ must know the momentum rules as it relates to kicks and really should know what those rules are as it relates to passes or fumbles. I think what happens we get so concerned with "protecting players" we think we need to get on the whistle. Anyone that has been officiating for any time has had an IW, but you have to take your time in football. The play is long dead before we blow the whistle in the first place. IW cause more problems than if you waited a second and blew the whistle at the right time.

Peace

[Bob M.]

REPLY: Jaysref...may I suggest that your mistake was more fundamental than whether the play was correctly called by your partner. You said in your post, "I felt something was wrong with this, but kept it for post game discussion." If you feel a mistake has been made in a misapplication of a rule, NEVER wait till halftime or after the game. Get your partner and the R together and express your concern. Chances are good that the R, who probably didn't see the play, would immediately know that this was whistled dead incorrectly and fix the problem using the IW procedures. Here's how I think you should have approached it: (1) Go to your partner and ask him what he saw. (2) If he saw the same thing as you, both of you bring it to the R. and R will sort it out. (3) If he did not see the same thing, still bring it to the R. He will ask the correct questions to get to the bottom of the issue.

If you have the September issue of REFEREE magazine, there's an article entitled "That's MY Call!" all about making calls outside of your area of responsibility. The author (a very good friend of mine ) interviewed a number of professional and D1 officials and supervisors. To a man, they all said that you never let an incorrect application of a rule go unchallenged. You may be wrong, but still get together and discuss it.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Bob M.

If you have the September issue of REFEREE magazine, there's an article entitled "That's MY Call!" all about making calls outside of your area of responsibility. The author (a very good friend of mine ) interviewed a number of professional and D1 officials and supervisors. To a man, they all said that you never let an incorrect application of a rule go unchallenged. You may be wrong, but still get together and discuss it.

A rules issue is a little different than a judgment difference. We can always disagree on judgment, but if we are about to apply a rule wrong, then we all have a responsibility. We can all debate why this BJ made the call they did. I could even make a case that he might have not really had momentum. Since the BJ made that call, we cannot go further without the issue being addressed that we are about to screw up a rule big time.

Peace