Off season brain teaser

[FredFan7]

I'm in the middle of learning softball rules (first year) but here's an offseason football rules question.

Team K punts the ball. The ball bounces at the R 5 yard line. K31 is standing ON the R goal line. He leans forward, feet on the goal line, catches the ball at the 1 yard line, continues to fall forward, feet still on the goal line, and downs the ball at the 3 yard line.

Where does the receiving team start is drive?

NFHS and NCAA if you wish.

[JasonTX]

NCAA:
The moment the ball is caught by Team A the ball becomes dead at that point. Team B will have the ball at the 1 yard yardline.

[jack015]

Originally posted by JasonTX
NCAA:
The moment the ball is caught by Team A the ball becomes dead at that point. Team B will have the ball at the 1 yard yardline.

Same ruling for NFHS

[ljudge]

It's funny how not everyone knows this. I spent 1/2 hour in a preGame conference this year trying to convince a linesman how this is different from the NFL. I was standing in for a referee who was ill and because I had to spend so much time in disagreement it almost got a little heated because I was coming across as stubborn. He thought if the foot touched the goal line it was an automatic touchback.

[grantsrc]

I had to reread the example a few times to make sure that you weren't getting at the fact that the standing on the goal line part impacted the play. Now I understand that you are illustrating the fact that this isn't a touchback.

[Forksref]

Why is the ball dead at the 1 if it never broke the plane? Isn't it the position of the ball that determines if it is dead?

[Bob M.]

Originally posted by Forksref
Why is the ball dead at the 1 if it never broke the plane? Isn't it the position of the ball that determines if it is dead?

REPLY: Because K recovered the kick. WHenever and wherever K recovers a scrimmage kick, it becomes immediately dead.

[Father of Two]

newbie here...If a player was standing on the sideline and came in contact with the ball, the ball would be considered OOB, yes? Then why would that not be true for someone standing on the goal line? If someone is standing on the goal line then the ball is still...

Actually I think I just answered by own question...I think the answer is that the end zone is still in the field of play, and it would be the same as if a player was standing on the 50 yd line with the ball on the 49. Conversely in this example, if the ball was on the offense, we never consider a ball carrier in the endzone even if his whole body is in, if the ball still remains in his hand in front of the goal line.

Is this logic correct?

[Bob M.]

Originally posted by Father of Two
newbie here...If a player was standing on the sideline and came in contact with the ball, the ball would be considered OOB, yes? Then why would that not be true for someone standing on the goal line? If someone is standing on the goal line then the ball is still...

Actually I think I just answered by own question...I think the answer is that the end zone is still in the field of play, and it would be the same as if a player was standing on the 50 yd line with the ball on the 49. Conversely in this example, if the ball was on the offense, we never consider a ball carrier in the endzone even if his whole body is in, if the ball still remains in his hand in front of the goal line.

Is this logic correct?

REPLY: Father...I think you came up with the right answer, but possibly not quite by the right logic. By definition (in rule 2) the 'field of play' is defined as the are between the two goal lines bounded by the sidelines. The end zones are NOT part of the field of play. The real reason is that the sidelines are considered boundary LINES. The goal line on the other hand is probably misnamed and should more appropriately be called a goal PLANE.

A player must touch the sideline or outside of it in order to be ruled out of bounds. For example, a player running in the field of play near the sideline who holds the ball out over the OOB area is still considered inbounds even though the ball broke the plane of the sideline. Conversely, a ball need only break the plane of the goal line in order to be ruled in the end zone. And failing to break the plane of the goal line with the ball leaves it in the field of play somewhere short of the goal line.

[Father of Two]

Bob, Thank you for the explanation. Makes sense, now I got it.

[Jim D]

Rememebr that even though a player's feet may touch the sideline at a certain point (say the 50), the ball is spotted where the BALL was at when the player's feet went our of bounds. If he were holding the ball forward, the spot could be at the 49 or 48 yard line.

Now in most cases a player holds the ball close to his body and we use where his feet went out as the spot but it's really where the ball was that counts.

[James Neil]

While we’re on the subject of side-lines, goal-lines, planes and such, we might as well cover all the basses (oops wrong sport
K9 free kicks from his 40.
a) R32 standing in the field of play at the R-20 reaches across the plane of the sideline and catches the football. His then goes out of bounds at the R-21.
b) R32 is straddling the sideline at the R-20 recovers the ball before it crosses the sideling plane and advances to the R-25
c) R32 is straddling the sideline at the R-20 catches the ball after it crosses the sideling plane.
d) R32 standing in the field of play at the R-20 reaches across the plane of the sideline and recovers the football; he then advances to the 50
e) K9 free kicks from his 40. The ball comes down and hits K20 on the top of his helmet at the R-49 and then goes out of bounds untouched by R at the R-30.
f) K free kicks from his 40. The ball comes down and hits K20 on the top of his helmet at the K-49 and then goes out of bounds untouched by R at the R-30.
g) K9 free kicks from the K-40. K70 muffs the ball at the 50 and the ball goes out of bounds at the K-45 after being muffed by R32.

Boy, this could go on forever. I better give it a brake