illegal substitution or something else?

[Topshelf]

Please review this play, and let me know your thoughts on the ruling:

A time out is called. Team A comes over to the sideline to confer with the coaches. A11, the QB, steps off the field and is handed the head sets to communicate with the coaches in the press box. When the time out is ended, A11 returns to the field with his teammates. RULING: Illegal substitution.


My theory is this:

Rule 2-30-1 states, "A player continues to be a player until a substitute enters the field and indicates to the player that he is replaced, or when the substitute otherwise becomes a player."
>
According to our scenerio, we have a player that is standing in his team box during a dead ball period (time out). I know a player cannot withdraw and reenter as a substitute during the same dead ball period, but that is
not what we have here. Case Book play *3.7.3 Situation A comes close to this scenerio. A player withdraws thinking that he is the 12th man, and he returns upon discovering his error. This play is legal as the person is a player, not a replaced player nor a substitute. Using this logic, I conclude that our scenerio is not illegal substitution.
>
>What is it? I would say that it is either an unauthorized conference (9-8-1f), as it does not conform with the requirements of an authorized conference, or it is a player using illegal communication equipment (1-6-2), or it is leaving the field between downs to gain an advantage (9-5-1f). Either way it is unsportsmanlike conduct. The only difference would be that the unauthorized conference penalty would have to be charged to the coach, and the other two options would be charged to the player.

Am I totally misguided? Please comment.

[MJT]

Originally posted by Topshelf
Please review this play, and let me know your thoughts on the ruling:

A time out is called. Team A comes over to the sideline to confer with the coaches. A11, the QB, steps off the field and is handed the head sets to communicate with the coaches in the press box. When the time out is ended, A11 returns to the field with his teammates. RULING: Illegal substitution.

My theory is this:

Rule 2-30-1 states, "A player continues to be a player until a substitute enters the field and indicates to the player that he is replaced, or when the substitute otherwise becomes a player."
>
According to our scenerio, we have a player that is standing in his team box during a dead ball period (time out). I know a player cannot withdraw and reenter as a substitute during the same dead ball period, but that is
not what we have here. Case Book play *3.7.3 Situation A comes close to this scenerio. A player withdraws thinking that he is the 12th man, and he returns upon discovering his error. This play is legal as the person is a player, not a replaced player nor a substitute. Using this logic, I conclude that our scenerio is not illegal substitution.
>
>What is it? I would say that it is either an unauthorized conference (9-8-1f), as it does not conform with the requirements of an authorized conference, or it is a player using illegal communication equipment (1-6-2), or it is leaving the field between downs to gain an advantage (9-5-1f). Either way it is unsportsmanlike conduct. The only difference would be that the unauthorized conference penalty would have to be charged to the coach, and the other two options would be charged to the player.

Am I totally misguided? Please comment.

I think it is illegal, and a USC foul, violating 1-6-2. Here is why I think that. Rule 1-6-2 states "phone and headsets may be used by coaches and other nonplayers, but not players." He is still a player, even though he is off the field during the TO. I know he cannot during at TO on the field, and by stepping into the team box during a TO does not make him a removed player, so he may not use the headphones.

Casebook 1-6-2 says "the QB of A: (a) after leaving the game and while in the team box, uses a headset to talk to a coach in the scouting booth; or (b) during a charged TO, comes to the sideline to confer with coaches who are wearing headphones." In both cases, these are legal.

In (a), by them saying "after leaving the game" tells us that he must be removed from the game before he can legally use the headphones. Also, in (b) it says during the TO he confers with coaches who have headphones - again illustrating that he can confer with them, but cannot put them on himself.

The foul for using field equipment illegally is USC.

[ljudge]

No illegal substitution and not an unauthorized conference. You can argue it is a USC because the QB is still a player by definition and therefore can't use the unauthorized equipment until he becomes (by rule) a non-player. In the case you mentioned he was always a player and never became a replaced player because his vacancy wasn't filled.

[MJT]

Originally posted by ljudge
No illegal substitution and not an unauthorized conference. You can argue it is a USC because the QB is still a player by definition and therefore can't use the unauthorized equipment until he becomes (by rule) a non-player. In the case you mentioned he was always a player and never became a replaced player because his vacancy wasn't filled.

How can you say, "you can argue it is a USC," it IS most definitely in violation of rule 1-6-2.

[Bob M.]

REPLY: No question...USC violation of 1-6-2. But how would you handle it? Would you let him come back and then bang him for the USC? Or, would you intercept him, and encourage his coach to subsitute for him because of the foul that is pending?

[JDLJ]

Bob M.

Good question. You don't really know it is a foul until the player returns to the field after the time out. Assuming you didn't have a chance to warn him when the coach first handed him the headphones, it will be a USC if he comes back on the field. I guess I would tell the coach about it and let him avoid the penalty with a substitution.

[waltjp]

This situation highlights the need for the wing officials to monitor the sidelines during a time out.

[ljudge]

MJT, we're in agreement! It's definitely a USC and should have chosen my words more carefully.

[Texoma_LJ]

If I am able to prevent a foul before it happens, all the better for the flow of the game, especially something along the sidelines that could be prevented with a little constructive officiating. If I am able to stop the player before he puts the headset on, no problem. If however, I am unable to do so because of attending to other duties at the time, but see it before the dead ball period ends, I would definitely want to explain the situation to the HC, what options are available, and the result of each of those desicions. He can make his own decision from there. He may not even be aware of what is happening on the sideline himself and, I am sure, would be highly grateful to have the option of taking the player out for one play rather than taking a 15 yard hickey for something that could have been prevented.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally posted by Topshelf
Please review this play, and let me know your thoughts on the ruling:

A time out is called. Team A comes over to the sideline to confer with the coaches. A11, the QB, steps off the field and is handed the head sets to communicate with the coaches in the press box. When the time out is ended, A11 returns to the field with his teammates. RULING: Illegal substitution.

Perfectly legal.